MitcherNeaf

Car has been sitting 4-5 years, getting it tuned-up but it is acting wierd. Usually when I try to start it, I can hear the fuel pump go but it wont crank at all, the battery is new, and if i take the key out and put it back in multiple times sometimes 20-30 times eventually it will start to crank, difficulty starting but it has 5 year old gas in it so that isn't the problem.

I checked the codes and the only one it is flashing is 46, vehicle anti-theft system- Poor electrical connection, open or short in circuit; incorrect ignition key or starting procedure; defective VATS modul; defective ECM

when i try to start it the check engine light and security light are both on the whole time. So not sure what that means. Where should I start, is it somehting to do with my key? due to the fact it starts occasionally, and usually after it starts i can shut it off and it will start agian with no problem.

thanks
Mitch

enswrob

vats module going bad?

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

I would look for signs of a mouse or other pest infestation. If the car has sat for that long, chances are that some wire in the VATS system is damaged in some way. Code 46 means that the ECM isn't receiving the 30Hz signal to tell it that it's okay to fire the fuel injectors, and the no crank confirms a VATS problem, as the module also runs a starter "enable" relay. I'd look at the wiring first, and then check to see if the key pellet is worn out and that is what is causing the problems.

MitcherNeaf

i am not familiar with the vats system, what is included in checking the system and wiring, i have a haynes manual which doesn't seem to go over it.
thanks
Mitch

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

The first thing I would do is to check the resistance of the key to make sure it's within the tolerances for your key code, since that is the easiest thing to do before you go diving under the dash for the VATS harnesses. Measure the resistance between the pellet and the metal part of the key.

MitcherNeaf

ok dont have an ohm meter so have to wait on that, would it be the key if it works sometimes and not other, plus i have 2 keys i go back and forth between and they both don't work then randomly start to work.
Mitch

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

Replace your key cylinder, it's going bad, it's a common issue with VATS systems, and is why they stopped making those systems.

Also you measure the resistance between each side of the pellet.

The key itself is rarely the problem.

You can also permamently bypass the VATS system by installing a resistor in the wiring harness that is between the steering column and the VATS module. The resistance value would need to match what your key's value is.

Another way to disable the VATS system is to install a chip in the ECM that has VATS disabled.

MitcherNeaf

ok so i have 2 keys, when i try the one key first it will start right up i can take that key out put it back in try again and it starts up everytime, if I try the other key it never works, and after i try using the 2nd key the 1st one wont work for awhile until I walk away and come back a few minutes later than the 1st key will work again. Could it be that the 2nd key is just broken and activates the VATS and wont allow anything to work on it for a certain period of time?

mitch

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

The #2 key is worn out, like I said above. The reason the first key won't work after trying the second one is because VATS has a time delay between starting attempts (4 min, I believe) before it will register the first key properly, if the ignition is shut off. The reason most people have problems with the VATS is the same reason why I switched out my factory lock cylinder and ignition key... After a long time and many cycles in and out of the lock, the key and the pellet get worn down. When the pellet gets worn down, the resistance no longer fits into the range allowed by the VATS module (there is a reason why the module has a range built into it that the key can fit into for its code) and the VATS disables the starter and fuel control circuit.

You need to measure the resistance of the good key (or have someone do it for you) and find out your key code so you can get a couple of replacement keys, which happen to be dirt cheap on eBay, as opposed to $30 at the dealer. Or you can bypass it as was stated above, but this leaves your car open to theft (as was the point to the VATS in the first place).

MitcherNeaf

oh ok thanks, so to measure the resistance i just go from the little metal piece on the black thing to the key iteself?
mitch

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Something like that, yes. Someone else can confirm. I don't have a VATS key, so I couldn't help there.

Terry Barlow

can the encoder module be bypassed?

Terry Barlow

my signal is not getting to starter relay or ecm.

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

Presumably your talking an 82 through 92 Camaro or Firebird ?

And , are you certain it's the VATS module itself , and not a "key read" issue where the VATS module isn't reading the key's resistance ?

If so , in my opinion , the easiest way is to get a chip burned for the ECM with VATS deleted , and do the VATS starter kill relay bypass . That will eliminate the VATS module entirely and requires VERY minimal wiring skills (for the relay bypass) VS the method of buying an aftermarket VATS emulator module and wiring that in to make the ECM think there is still a functioning VATS system .

And no , before you ask , if your VATS module IS in fact dead , just doing the VATS starter kill relay bypass alone will NOT make your car run , both the starter relay AND the ECM chip are required (jumping the relay only will make the starter crank the engine , but you'll still have no injector pulse till the ECM chip is addressed)

Good Luck with it , , and , if your gonna ask many more questions here it would be helpful if you'll fill in what year Camaro/Firebird we're talkin here , certain things ARE different across the 1982 through 1992 model years ....