Twitch RS

I have a 91 RS with the 3.1 V6 and the 700r4. I know that the transmission is pretty decent, with a good ratio, and the car has pretty new exhaust. I want to get a little more performance out of the car. I can't afford a turbo, and don't have the patience or money for a motor swap. What are some reasonably priced things I could add to get more performance? Like would a new intake be worth the money? things like that.

SageMoonblade

There are several "cheap" mods you can do to make the car perform. Headers, high flow cats, new intake manifolds, chipping the ecu and much more. There are many Fiero parts that will fit the 2.8 and 3.1 cars. Stores like www.westcoastfiero.com
and
www.fierostore.com/?gclid=CP2GwtjeopcCFRPyDAodRgmssA
they have intakes and some other parts that will fit. However the fiero headers will not work with our cars unless they are cut and re-welded.

I know Pacesetter makes a set of headers for the 2.8 cars but they might fit the 3.1 as well I have never really looked into them www.pacesetterexhaust.com/camaro.php

Not sure if this company is still in business but you can try contacting them. www.trueleo.com

The one problem you will odds are run into is that even with these upgrades your performance gains will be modest at best. To really make power you will have to do atleats one if not more of the following: increase the compression ratio, add boost, increase the RPM of the engine, use NO2, or swap the engine. If you have more questions feel free to ask.

Another person you might want to try to check with is the owner of this www.cardomain.com/ride/708666

Francis T.

The single best thing you can do to more power is to ditch the stcok intake and either go carb or trueleo, The stock intakes negates/limits all other mods whereas it just dont breath above 4.5k rpm. And the trueleo,com will also help with gas milage whereas it the engine won't keep getting richer and richer above 4.5k. Just go to the Fiero forum -they make an f-bod one too- and ask about how well they work or how well crabs work.
Intake link


Fiero Forum
http://www.pennock.nl/forum.html

project89

iTrader: (1)

lol at u pushing that intake, its a total piece of 700$ crap

327???

If you could open the combustion chambers enough on a set of 3x00 heads you could probably lower the compression enough to swap the entire top end+cam and gain a significant amount of power. My 3100 lumina makes 30hp more than my firebird without having a significantly bigger engine or lumpy cam profile.

DemonKnightDK

actually the 3x00 heads and top end will fit...

K-slice

iTrader: (2)

I've looked for a good intake for the 3.1 for a long time an never been able to find one.

grimmcs

iTrader: (1)

Yeah...but I believe what 327 is saying is, you would have to make the combustion chambers bigger to work with stock RWD pistons...and if you did that it would be easier to use.

And Id have to agree somewhat with dave on the Truleo...If I remember correctly, the only good use for that intake is with a turbo/SC because it loses velocity when the air gets to the LIM on a NA motor. But $600 for that manifold???

Francis T.

Those intakes are very good and work great. The early ones -5 years ago- had too many sections in the TB neck and thus did not look good though they flowed great. I dont why he says they are crap? If you go to Pennocks Fiero Forum and ask about them, you should gets lots of feedback from users. The main reason the Fiero V6 -and f-bods too I guess- where for years considered not worth trying to hotrod was the restrictive intakes. They look good but dont flow worth a darn. Dont take my work for it, ask people that have them.

project89

iTrader: (1)

one person on this forum used one and the car lost a decent amount of power on the dyno.

i have also seen first hand someone with a fiero back to back test one of those intakes at the racetrack. and they lost an avg of .300-.400 off there et's once they swapped to the truleo

another memeber here actually flow benched a stock manifold,and a ported stocker, both of wich will outflow the stock cyl heads

not to mention the truleos 700$ price tag for that much money u could do an entire 3x00 top end swap or for around 2-300 bucks u could have a sheetmetal upper plenum built

the dpownfall to the stocker isnt its flow, its its runner lenght its 19 inches from the runner entrance in the plenum to the back of the valve if i recall my mesurements correctly.


theres a lil nmore to it then that but u get the point

K-slice

iTrader: (2)

Ya, the $700 price tag will make me not buy it. For that much I could almost buy a 305 and drop it in. So, is there a good intake for the 3.1 that everyone can agree on? Just looking at the stock ones you can tell they're pretty restrictive.

project89

iTrader: (1)

the throttle body is actually more restrictive then the intake manifold.
the intake does outflow the cyl heads its the fact it has such a long runner that power drops off at 4,500 rpms. if ur keeping the iron heads u can do enough witht he stock intake that it wont really hurt,

SageMoonblade

How about someone just builds a tubular twin throttle body cross-ram intake? It really isn't that hard to do. The biggest problem is getting it to clear everything.

project89

iTrader: (1)

its been done


made over in austrailia

SageMoonblade

Well then, whats one of those things run? I am sure something like that will be far from reasonable.

tchernobog

Yesplz.

project89

iTrader: (1)

im not sure, i dont remeber the website were i found it but i think it was around 1,100 bucks

in all hoesty u can Build one of those out of the rwd intakes cheap as hell, i have seen fiero guys do it,though many of them have come out quite ugly and crude but the gains were worth the ugliness

SageMoonblade

Well I am not sure about you all but to me pretty doesn't always matter that much. For 1100 bucks you had better be gaining some major flow and still using what seems to be a factory or close to it lower manifold I am not sure how far it will go. I cant really say much about it bad without knowing more about its gains but it would be too expensive for my tastes but if you can find the website I would like to know so I can add it to my collection.

project89

iTrader: (1)

that manifold its fabed form the base up no stock parts, i came across it while searching a while back for potter racing stuff and sheetmetal intakes

zs&tas

Ahh thats a Q i keep meaning to ask, with all your experience ! i will be running oem parts but fully ported heads up, and modded intake, mild cam ?what size throttle should i use for high rpm 1k idle ?

Francis T.

On the dyno; I dont know what else he had going on to lose power but it sure it was not the intake! As for the guy at the track? Did he know what he was doing? Lots people race Fieros with them and love them. Just ask at Pennock's Fiero forum, there must be 50 or more folks with them.

BTW: they dont cost $700 they cost $600. And dont bother to get the facts first hand from users, just listen to guy. Anyone that thinks the factory intake is worth retaining or boring out, either dont understand things like god-awful bends, narrow intake neck, etc etc or is not looking to make one these engines really scream.

project89

iTrader: (1)

lol 600 is even to much.

the guys with the fiero yeah he knew exactly what he was doing also the car that dynoed here had no other mods except going from the stocker to the truleo to compare the numbers. it did have a cam and ported heads etc. but the car was dynboed only with the truleo intake swaped on no other ineternals were changed

we have a 15 sec na camaro on the boards using a stock manifold, and i belive another one in the 14's

and as for myself ive already built sheetmetal plenums for the stockers and i also have the fastest v6 camaro on the boards here being able to run well into the 12's
----------
there was a tb swap u could do that was bolt on but i forget what it was, try asking firstfirebird im sure he knows

IrocJoeCool

I can't imagine people on here saying that the trueleo intkae is a piece of junk. I have ridden in a Fiero with that intake and it really improves the breathing at 4500+ rpms over the stocker. maybe the people who lost power did so because of their tuning(or lack of)

SLOWFIVEOH

iTrader: (2)

Trueleo does help from what I've seen but the gains are DEF. not worth the price in any way

Twitch RS

ya I wasn't really thinking intake anyways since the factory is soemwhat capable. I just not sure what I wanna do I don't even know how fast it is now cause I still havent weeded out the problem with it so if I mash the gas it bogs so idk...I just know it won't touch what I am used to.

bl85c

iTrader: (2)

I keep repeating it and by no means are these engines torque monsters, but that's what they're suited for in stock trim. If I were trying to squeez more out of it I'd go for things that will boost your torq- higher c/r, torqey cam, opening up the heads ect. There's alot of torque to be had in these little things without having to bump your head against the rpm roof.

327???

My 2.8/t5 ran a best of..............18.2 at 75, it's a monster.

96v6bird

Yeeah. Thats about what the OP can expect out of his unless he goes all out. Which requiers more then a few hundred bucks.

If you want a faster car sell it and buy a 3rd gen with a V8 in it. Your cheapest option, IMO. Hell an lt1 car could be had for around 3k.

Even if you shave a few seconds off your car, you still wont be happy with it. I run 15's and I'm not happy enough.

uhlanstan

I am a member of the fiero forum and have owned many Camaros,,some people prefer a V 6 ,, the the trueleo headers have an excellent reputation ,also the intake trueleo spend a lot of time and money comming up with a SUPERIOR design for the fiero V 6 ..I can not afford them they are the TOP Horse Power producer.
I do not own Trueleo headers ,but members of my fiero club do This is so much better than any other header on the market for the 2.8 the 3.1 and 3.4 by dyno test by various members of the pennock fiero forums ..dyno test after dyno test has proven the trueleo headers ,, these are not mass produced headers ,,The fiero community is sold on the Trueleo headers by seat of the pants dyno and dyno testing

Guest

Point taken- If the Trueleo intake were as good as this guy claims you would have come in here ranting and raving about it instead of the headers. The intake is a piece of garbage.

nixon5

start off with a cold air intake means filter outside the car under the bumper... its cheap and easy to make took me like 20 mins to do at 11:00 at night in 30 degree weather. It makes a difference i gained a few more torque from it. Then if i were you ide prob put in a cam from delta.

uhlanstan

Ah so gentle reader I see some do not like my trueleo post!! well, well gear heads,fellow camaristas,& others(you know who you are!! listen read and learn ..it is true the reports of performance have not all been glowing ,,many 2.8 V6 owners report the increase in power is not what was expected, yes it is true ,,most of these were geaheads who had to modify the stock fiero intake and they compared the trueleo to thier ported intake and thier was not a tremendous gain,so if you are running a 2.8 V6with a ported intake you may not recieve a great gain in **** power,so unfortunate. how ever if you are running a 3.4 pushrod 60oV6 and have any mechanical skill what so ever ,,you better fasten the seat belts because the trueleo is just about the best modification you can make it is almost as good as my present Ukraine petite girl friend who appears to be hidding 2 giant melons under her shirt,,just above her tiny waist,,yes they are as much fun as your dreams can imagine.. the technical types,dyno test insisters, diviant fiero forum lurkers ,and former sheepherders as my self swear by the truleo intake.. it is by far the best intake on the market you have to go to a hot blower NO! not my ukraine lady,one that sits on top of an engine!! the austrailian intake,, the wcf intake and others are like my USMC experience " the best I could do fell far short of what needed to be done "" the other intakes fallllllll far ,far, far short of the truleo,, I am now facing Mecca and pray to allah that the great Francis Trueleo intake may live a long life in the fiero community because V 6 engines in Camaro,s aquiped (aquiped) with other unmentional intake will eat fiero V6 trueleo dust ,,all hail the trueleo.. go to pennock fiero forum and search the many debates about the trueleo intake many, many, many some with indepth engineering, made simple for the great unwashed warmongers such as my arrogant better than all self,,let us gather to worship and whisper & shout the name of Trueleo who at great personal expense brought forth and shared with all his creation ,,non beleavers to the rear shame on you!! A legend is in creation to go with Smokey Yunick,Edelbrock,Brock Yates,Isky, and Juan Fangio,,, May the great rapture come!! I pray for it and all Toyota owners will be lifted in a great rapture to Mt Fuji Japan bannished from the country they help destroy you know who who you are!!
GOD ,GUTS ,GUNS AND FIERO,S MADE AMERICA GREAT ...NEWTON,U.S. SGT.USMC(ABN)

chevyracingrox

..........................k...not sure what I got from that one yet...

EDIT: maybe just a bit over the top, don't you think? btw, I had a 4 speed toyota pick-up before my camaro, sure its no comparison for performance, but it was a really good truck.

project89

iTrader: (1)

ill put this intake against a truleo intake any day of the week




and i know it will outflow, out rev, and make mor epower then that 700 $ pos

ive seen first hand a car lose almost .5 of a second down the 1/4 mile bolting on a truleo

a member of these boards made less hp and less tq with the truleo then a stocker on a dyno

chevyracingrox

when did you make that thing?!

project89

iTrader: (1)

2 maybe 3 years ago

project89

iTrader: (1)

dubbed the pizza box by a few

project89

iTrader: (1)

project89

iTrader: (1)

and this was an all out race manifold for fwd heads i never finished






still have it and all the runers are welded up and finished, just needs a plenum added

chevyracingrox

how do you get the fuel rail on? I'll admit it does look like a pizza box. nice welds though. what did you use to weld it up with?
EDIT: so many intakes so quickly!!! FWD looks pretty neat. oh yea, how much did your pizza box cost to build? you know, the one that puts truelo to shame?

project89

iTrader: (1)

i have a 300 amp miller syncro wave machine at the shop that i do most of my aluminum welding with

the plenum bolts onto the middle intake section, so its just like a stocker in 3 pieces

chevyracingrox

sounds like a neat way to weld aluminum. i know i've never used one.

looking at your pizza box intake I thought you welded it right to the middle intake. our intakes would be a lot easier to build custom of the fuel rail wasn't right over the LIM ports.

auto-x1990RS

i've got a question. are you on crack when you post??? because i've never seen a more F*cked up jarbled mess of a post in my life

put the crack pipe down before you post

uhlanstan

They said I was not enthusiastic about the Trueleo ,,there seem to be
doubters about any product,,the trueleo is dyno proven and owner approved ,,the trueleo needs little tuning ability there are many queeks that can not tune they just stick parts on ,and hope for the best,what would I know I only installed my first swap in 1955,, Olds rocket V8 into 49 ford,, was a mechanic for many years, build racing motorbike engines & raced flattrack scooters,I had limited skills as a flat tracker but my Triumph 650cc scooters would out run every thing else on the straights.
The best way to gain preformance is not a swap,, camaros are cheap just buy a V8
It was love at second sight,I did not know she was wealthy the first time
GOD,GUNS,GUTS,AND FIERO,S MADE AMERICA GREAT

K-slice

iTrader: (2)

This whole thread is so f*%&ed up...

MAYBE, the Trueleo makes a difference on Fieros, and maybe it doesnt on f-bodies. Since, from what I can, tell the 2 people who own fiieros here seem to love em, but everyone with a Firebird or Camaro hate them.

MFaust89

all u believe is buls**T. beginning from the religion and ending on the intake (plus, no religious comments on this forum are allowed PLEASE). I gonna be a good guy and just think that your miracle intake works really well. now, i gonna ask u to take a "loooooook" to the TPI intake and compare to the trueleo inatake. seems like they have common stuff. i let u figure it out all the common characteristics by urself!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONV96pgIeaU

found this on youtube, but it is an 3.4L on a fiero with a trueleo intake. the engine is that 800rpms which doesnt need that much induction of air and also makes that noise. seems like it sucks a lot of air, but the few amount of air passing by the filter makes the noise.

ps- i just believe on this intake if mounted on a f-body 2.8L (not running rich) with dyno proves.

project89

iTrader: (1)

wow ppl really are dumb, thats the iac making that noise.

take any f-body and move the lever that actuates the tps sensor while the car is idling and it wil open the iac wide open making the same noise

CC_HotRod

I am going to lock this thread b/c it has turned into a debate over the trueleo. This topic has been covered numerous times before. Do a search.