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I got some new bearings for the 7.5 gear swap I'm doing, then I decided to just get a gear installation kit which already had mainly Timken bearings in it, which I know are the gold standard. I've been comparing the pinion bearing I originally got - which is a made in China parts store bearing - with the Timken pinion bearing in the kit and have noticed some minor differences. The main two differences I can see are the pins that the rollers rotate on of the Chinese bearing are significantly larger in diameter than the ones on the Timken bearing, and the cage on the Chinese bearing is made out of thicker metal and it extends over 1/16" further down below the bottoms of the rollers than the Timken. I'm wondering if these design differences are insignificant or whether they might affect the performance and longevity of one bearing vs the other. Also, is the steel a Chinese bearing going to be the same quality and hardness as a Timken bearing? I'm asking because one of my other cars has a 7.5 rear end that I'd like to rebuild that doesn't need a gear swap and I'd like to use the original set of bearings I bought in that so they don't go to waste, but Obviously I only want to do the once and not have to worry about a bearing failure.
Smaller rollers are better (more points of contact).
The cage doesn't matter.
Who knows about "hardness". No telling what those people are doing. Harder isn't always better; metal that's too hard will shatter on impact.
There are other "brands" of bearings that are as "good" as Timken. Several of the Japanese brands (Koyo, SKF, NSK, NTN) although not all of their products are made in Japan; Bower, NDH (former division of GM), some of the German companies (***), etc. Sure, Timken is a good reliable name, but far from the only one.
Something to always remember: most of the rest of the world got bombed to rubble during WW2, EXCEPT the US. Bearing plants, being a high-value military target, were always hit as much as possible. More than any other basic industry with the possible exception of oil and rubber, the bearing industry was FLATTENED. The rest of the world, particularly Europe and Japan, then had to rebuild that kind of industries from SCRATCH in the years after; the US mostly just coasted along on old obsolete plants. It's not as bad now as it was in the 70s & 80s, since for a variety of reasons, US plants have been upgraded or replaced; but for a long time, US heavy industry was FAR FROM "world leading" as far as quality, in spite of its volume. Think back to the Firestone tire debacle of the 70s for a classic example of how bad it got.
Pay more attention to what's in the box, especially country of origin, than the name on the box. Avoid China, India, Vietnam, Malaysia, etc. Not so much because those places "can't" or "don't know how to" make good products; rather, anyone who would decide to source their product there is usually after the cheeeeepest possible labor (lowest cost), so given that, how many other corners have been cut.
Yes, I know Timken isn't the only good bearing maker and, yes, I've heard Koyo, SKF, Ina and *** bearing are good quality bearings. According to this article there are good and bad bearing companies in China: https://www.bearing-news.com/buying-...bearings-know/ . You have to wonder where all the "bad" Chinese bearings end up, in production cars or being sent to places like Autozone and Oreillys as "Duralast" or "Masterpro". It's sad that Federal Mogul bearings are being made in China now: I wonder if they are being made in the "bad" or "good" bearing factories.
I get put off by cheap parts made in China and try to avoid them. Sometimes, though, that's all that is available. A good chunk of the repop parts for our cars, what little there are, are made there. The Chinese seem to be good at making anything you could imagine: some things are good enough for what they are for, some things probably should be considered for short term use.
I suppose I should return these Chinese pinion bearings in case they came from one of the "bad" bearing factories in China.
Yeah I wish I knew how to tell. I doubt they're all "bad". I just don't want to get stuck with some crap that won't last 30 days so I avoid em all.
I did some work once for a company in my town that makes high-end valves (ball valves and such) for applications like acid-mfg plants, oil refineries, etc. They often get POs from companies in China that expressly state "no parts made in China will be accepted". I guess they KNOW how it is...
Smaller rollers are better (more points of contact).
The cage doesn't matter.
Who knows about "hardness". No telling what those people are doing. Harder isn't always better; metal that's too hard will shatter on impact.
There are other "brands" of bearings that are as "good" as Timken. Several of the Japanese brands (Koyo, SKF, NSK, NTN) although not all of their products are made in Japan; Bower, NDH (former division of GM), some of the German companies (***), etc. Sure, Timken is a good reliable name, but far from the only one.
Something to always remember: most of the rest of the world got bombed to rubble during WW2, EXCEPT the US. Bearing plants, being a high-value military target, were always hit as much as possible. More than any other basic industry with the possible exception of oil and rubber, the bearing industry was FLATTENED. The rest of the world, particularly Europe and Japan, then had to rebuild that kind of industries from SCRATCH in the years after; the US mostly just coasted along on old obsolete plants. It's not as bad now as it was in the 70s & 80s, since for a variety of reasons, US plants have been upgraded or replaced; but for a long time, US heavy industry was FAR FROM "world leading" as far as quality, in spite of its volume. Think back to the Firestone tire debacle of the 70s for a classic example of how bad it got.
Pay more attention to what's in the box, especially country of origin, than the name on the box. Avoid China, India, Vietnam, Malaysia, etc. Not so much because those places "can't" or "don't know how to" make good products; rather, anyone who would decide to source their product there is usually after the cheeeeepest possible labor (lowest cost), so given that, how many other corners have been cut.
I felt this was a great post.
When GM no longer had it's own Bearing Contracts, Timken was Excellent.
Koyo has also proven to be excellent.
China is trying to grow past a "Quanity/ Cheap" Manufacturer to a "Quality" Manufacturer.
They are slowly doing it.
So I only have one exception to make about this Post...
and it is not specific to Automotive Parts, but to Electronics in General.
China (Taiwan) is the Electronics capital of the World.
All American Electronics Companies have their components come from Taiwan.
All PC, Computer, Cell Phone, Etc... components come from Taiwan.
And they are the Best that one can get.
There are few exceptions for some select Japanese Components and actually a hand full of American Components.
But Taiwan is the KING.
Last edited by vorteciroc; 09-21-2023 at 06:20 PM.
Historically, Taiwan has only very occasionally been under the yoke of "China"; they usually managed either to throw off their conquerors, or "China" 's vitality simply ran out. Most of the east Asian peoples have had to deal with this at one time or another, or more: look at the history of Korea or Vietnam for examples. The indigenous Taiwanese people are more closely related to the people of the Pacific Islands (Philippines etc.) than those of mainland China anyway. They're not really "Chinese" ethnically.
The Chinese Communist Party's obsession with Taiwan, in 2023, is directly traceable to the fact that the Nationalist govt of "China" (the ones who overthrew the Imperial system) escaped to Taiwan when the Chinese Communist Party took power from them and tried to kill them. Whether they were a "good" govt of China from what... 1912? 1917? to 1948, is of course open to debate. But that's not the point. It's run by people the CCP hates. For that reason, Taiwan as an unconquered otherwise-governed entity is a constant source of wounded pride.
Meanwhile, Taiwan has developed a very non-Communist economy (not all at once or in a straight line or perfectly, any more than the US has). It's based on the rule of law wherein The Law is a constant that supersedes the momentary will of an individual or a party, and on individuals independently planning their own participation in the economy (aka "capitalism") as opposed to central govt planning and assignment. Taiwan isn't really part of "China" in this matter. Like Japan or Korea, they are an industrious and hard-working people, willing to work hard to earn their place in the world. Very different from the CCP, wherein a small "elite" controls EVERYTHING, and any attempt at any form of individualism is ruthlessly eliminated.
I'm old enough to remember when "made in Japan" was a slur, a truism indicating poor quality. Having been among those people, and knowing their nature of being perfect and meticulous in every possible way, I can only imagine how it must have irritated and sickened them to be making GARBAGE for export, although at the time, that was the only way to lift their country out of the RUBBLE. They built back BETTER than they were before and now their products and institutions are the equal of any anywhere in the world. Maybe someday the Chinese will get rid of the CCP, and take full advantage of the initiative of the people and their intelligence, and get out of being the "low-cost" provider and slaves to their CCP masters.
I was afraid I was going to open up a can of worms if I brought up China.
I ordered the R&P rebuild kit with the Timken bearings off of eBay because the parts stores around here couldn't get one, and if they could it would be so overpriced I wouldn't want to get it anyway. It was from All Powersports Drivetrains.
The individual bearings I got originally were off of eBay, too: I just can't bring myself to pay the crazy prices the parts stores here charge for bearings. The Chinese main pinion bearing and race are "Coastal" brand, and wouldn't have ordered them if I knew they were made in China. The smaller pinion bearing and race I ordered are Koyo, and the carrier bearings and races are SKF (Hecho en Mexico).
I like to patronize local businesses when I can, but the parts stores around here have such outrageous prices on things such as bearings it's not even funny. Also, I quit going to Oreillys (O-ripoff) because they have lousy customer service: they basically ignore you when you walk in the door and go to the parts counter.
I'm also trying to wean myself off of Rock Auto, although it's hard if they have the best deal on something I need such as the new axles I ordered. I get so sick and tired of playing their multiple location shipping game, which I think is a bit of a scam. Also, they have no customer service whatsoever, so if you have a problem with your order, good luck!
I searched for more than a few years for hubs that were NLA. I finally found hubs that came with bearings. These were promptly thrown into the scrap metal bin and replaced with Koyo bearings from a Koyo box.
The other way is to avoid using ebay and Amazon as a source.
I searched for more than a few years for hubs that were NLA. I finally found hubs that came with bearings. These were promptly thrown into the scrap metal bin and replaced with Koyo bearings from a Koyo box.
The other way is to avoid using ebay and Amazon as a source.
I don't understand what is wrong with using eBay as a parts source. I have bought parts for many years off of eBay with very good results. A lot of the time you can find parts on eBay that you can't find anywhere else, especially NOS or NORS made in USA parts. Sure it's not perfect, but nothing is when it comes to buying car parts.
I'd rather buy parts off of eBay than get caught up in the Rock Auto shipping scam or pay overly inflated prices at the local Oreillys (or fill in the blank national chain auto parts store) and have to put up with poor customer service and not knowing where the parts THEY order for you are made. Usually these parts stores have to order parts for older cars like ours, anyway, because they don't stock them.
09-21-2023, 12:43 PM
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