gixxer9

I have seen a lot of good discussions on this board with some good advice. I am currently trying to figure out the best intake for my IROC. I know that the complete kit for a stealthram is half the cost of the miniram.
Here are my stats:
ZZ4 shortblock
AFR 195 heads with Comp Cams matched springs
Comp Cams XR294HR (294 300 .540 .562)
Comp Cams Magnum 1.6 Roller rockers (.576 .600)
Edelbrock high-flo base
TPIS pressure regulator with 550hp fuel pump
TPIS level 5 PROM
SLP 1 3/4 non-airtube headers
Flowmaster 3" exhaust
T-5 trans
Auburn Gear Pro-Series with Richmond 4.10's

What intake would be the best for me, the miniram or the stealthram?

Thanks for your help,
mike

camarojoe

I'd go with the mini-ram with your setup. The choice is made easier by knowing that you have 4.10 gears in the rear.

Free Bird

iTrader: (1)

I couldn't justify the 800+ price tag for an intake manifold. Its a piece of aluminum. One day TPIS will get over it.

D Stroy H8

Yeah the prcie sucks. However, a converted LT1 intake is about half that, and it flows just as good as the mini-ram.

gixxer9

Yeah the price does suck, but I built this motor with the miniram in mind and I didn't feel I had an alternative. I checked out a website that was dedicated to converting LT1 intakes to L98 motors, but I can't believe they would flow as much as a miniram. I visited another sight and it appears that the stealthram outflows the miniram as casted. Even if the miniram does perform better in my case, is it worth the extra $600? I don't know, that's why I'm asking you guys.

Thanks,
mike

P.S. Comp cams says my powerband for this cam is 2800-6100.


http://www.lt1intake.com/services.htm

http://www.stealthram.com/flowcomparison.html

gixxer9

CamaroJoe, it sounds like you've got a pretty hot motor. Would you take the miniram over the HSR? Or would you take the HSR and use the leftover cash to buy a NOS kit?

D Stroy H8

No I am pretty sure the LT1 conversions flow similar numbers to the Miniram. Even on the Stealthram page it paired the MR and LT1 together for peak TQ and HP rpm range. There is a small difference in runner length, I am not sure which one has longer runners, but both are very short and the difference is marginal!

BADBIRD009

the mini ram will out flow an LT1 intake by far. ive got the TPIS insiders handbook and they come up with some really impressive numbers with that intake, even on lt1's. the mini ram is really good for top end power. its made to give you peak power around 5000 rpms and up, the impressive thing is you wont lose much low end power, like you typicaly do when you make power that high.

i think it would be worth your while to go with the mini ram.

gixxer9

Does anyone have a miniram or hsr or LT1 conversion? All of you guys make good points. I do believe that the miniram/LT1 intake may make a bit more power on top, but I'm leaning towards the stealth ram because of another good article I read.


http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...holleystealth/

John Millican

iTrader: (1)

I challange your statement that the MR will outflow the LT1 intake by far. I believe you are wrong.

Also believing that "insider book" is a book made by TPIS, the same company that makes the MR so they are quite biased towards the MR.

Lastly, TPIS never made a MR intake for the LT1 engine. In fact, the only direct replacement high performance intake for the LT1 engine is the LT4 intake and it still requires you to replace the heads to LT4 heads as well. That says alot about the ability of the LT1 intake. Of course you might say I'm a little biased as well.

92 zzz28

I wonder if anyone has flow numbers of the HSR compared to the Mini Ram. And/or the LT1/LT4.

I have seen both the Miniram and HSR, not side by side unfortunately, to think that there will not be any signficant difference between the two. THe major factor in my desicion was price. I admit the MiniRam looks more attractive to me, but not enough to justify the price difference. Just my opinion...

Tibo

iTrader: (15)

If you want serious fuel injection, then Holley makes a high rise tunnel ram Tuned port injection system. It comes as fuel injection in a box. Everything from fuel pump to lines, injectors,filters, pressure regulators, computer, EVERYTHING you need.The weakest kit is said to have brought an stock 350 TPI up to 350hp. The better kit (the kit I'm taking out a shop loan for) brought it up to 485 horsepower. Guarunteed to never run lean. It's only 2,000 dollars. It is advertised in Summit.





3 inch Flowmaster American Thunder with 3 inch high flow cat.
Total Accel ignition system
World cylinder heads
Drilled and slotted rotors

BADBIRD009

you are absolutly right. i just took a look at my tpis book and i was mistaken, mini ram is only for tpi.

i also noticed that is says you will need a $300 fuel rail and their level VI prom. making the mini ram $1200 plus the prom. thats a lot of money for what you get. maybe the lt1 conversion is a better deal than i thought.

gixxer9

John, do you think that an LT1 intake would make impressive power with my setup? Also, what do your intakes flow and what kind of power would it make on my motor?

thanks,
mike

Matt87GTA

The Miniram will outflow an LT1 intake - not by a whole lot by any means, but it will. But even TPIS will tell you that if you have an LT1 intake you do not need to upgrade it as it is a very capable intake.

And BTW, TPIS does make an LT1 Miniram. You can trust me on that one .

Matt87GTA

You are going to need a custom PROM of some sort with either setup so the cost on the PROM will be the same. You don't have to go with a TPIS PROM if you use a Miniram. You also can buy the plain rail kit and use some 6AN lines and fittings from your favorite source to save some more cash on it....

You might also want to call in to TPIS and ask them if they have a few blemished MRs laying around... They often get a few from the foundry that are a little messed up cosmetically and they will usually sell them for substantial discounts....

camarojoe

The motor is not put together yet, actually. I'd buy a used mini-ram over a stealthram and I'd probably buy a new stealth ram and a NOS kit over buying a new mini-ram. I do think the MR looks better though and I like the rpm capabilities of it more.

OMINOUS_87

If you really want to digest some facts about capability check out camaroz28.com. Pleanty of guys running real fast with LT1 intakes at mad mph.

However running a bastardized intake with no real gaurantee of the fact that you will be able to properly mod it and a goofy looking t-stat setup is another question in itself.

gixxer9

The miniram is a beautiful intake. I remember in my TPIS catalog that they have an LT1 build up putting out something like 430hp or so and I think it was the stock intake. I lost my cover where the article was. Does anyone know what I'm talking about?

GTA91

iTrader: (1)

I ran the LT1 intake for a short while and with stock iron heads, a LT4 hotcam, and a 6spd with 4.10's, the thing was a blast to drive and would hit my 6300 rev limiter with no problem. Was it bastardized and rigged? Yes. Did it work? Yes. Was it fairly cheap? Yes.


*Now, I have sold it b/c I needed the money for a rebuild (bottom end crapped out) and now I'm looking to build a stroker with my spare block sitting here. I'm already looking at intakes and the HSR looks like the best bang for the buck. The miniram is very sweet, but like guys above mentioned.... new HSR and NOS kit for the same price as a new MR. That just kicks a$$! The HSR gets my vote!

gixxer9

The miniram is a beautiful intake. I remember in my TPIS catalog that they have an LT1 build up putting out something like 430hp or so and I think it was the stock intake. I lost my cover where the article was. Does anyone know what I'm talking about?

gixxer9

I asked a friend who has the Performance Trend Engine Analyzer software to simulate both the miniram and the stealth ram on my motor. The software results were that both intakes produced around 380 RWHP. Miniram at 6700 rpm, and the stealth ram at 6200 rpm. I don't feel like revving 7000 rpm all the time so I ordered the stealth ram tonight.

camarojoe

That's a good one!

92 zzz28

You'll be happy with the Stealth Ram. You got the AFPR right?

mrr23

and you guys with the HSR don't forget to send a pic of the car and stats just like on the HSR CARS page to add to it. click the green banner.

gixxer9

Yeah 92 Z, I got the rail kit with the afpr, in fact, I got everything I need coming to me except for the small cap distributor. I don't know if I should get a junkyard one for $50 or get a new one for like $150. Both of them would have stock modules in them so I'll probably just get the used one and buy another DUI module for it. I am using the DUI stuff in my current distributor and have been happy with them.

Ricktpi

I have an extra small cap dist & MSD Blaster coil (GM style) available since I converted to crank trigger. PM me if you are interested.

gixxer9

Stealth ram and fuel rail kit came in from Summit today. I'm just waiting on the AN fuel line kit and the small cap distributor which should be here by wednesday! I'm very excited about finally having an intake that matches the rest of my motor. My IROC sounds great but is not very impressive power-wise because of the mismatched intake. I will be interested in selling my Edelbrock High-flo base (shaved 2 tenths alone),unported, if anyone needs it. I had a CC XR282hr in it originally and it ran much better then, of course I knew I was going to a different intake setup so I opted for a bigger one (XR294hr). I will keep everyone up to date with my install complete with review in performance gains.

LD85

iTrader: (2)

You MUST decide how many RPM you want, if you go over 6300RPM then you MIGHT need Sold Lifters either intake can take you o 7500 RPM IF THE MOTOR IS DESIGNED RIGHT!

89Formula350WS6

Was the Edelbrock base the only non-stock part of your tpi setup?

gixxer9

89 Formula, yes my tpi is all stock except for the base manifold. I installed 24# motorsport injectors because my car was originally a 305. I added the base last winter (motor is 3 yrs old but only 12000 miles) and it helped until I installed the larger cam (I put the motor together with visions of minirams dancing in my head).

gixxer9

I'm still waiting on my distributor and my AN fuel lines, but as soon as they come in I will begin the install. I should pick up a ton of power over my LTR setup. As the IROC sits now, the best I can do is 13.6-7's at about 105. I go back and forth with my friend in his 99 LS1 Z28. With the stealthram I should be able to run from him on the big end like I do now out of the hole. I pull on him until the 1/8 mile and then he starts to run me down.

Kingtal0n

<b>http://www.gmhightechperformance.co..._holleystealth/</b>

I, too, have chosen a stealthram and under-manifold fogger over the mini-ram. Not installed yet, but soon.

Viewing the dyno results from the article above set me thinking. if you check the torque numbers that motor pulled right at the top, 2850, you will see they actually PEAK up there.
now i know im not crazy, but having a stealthram and peaking your torque below the TPI peak-torque area, isnt that a bit odd?

heck if you check the "estimated" stealthram torque numbers they say peak torque around 4600 rpms.. not 2850...

If you check the cam specs, 218/228 @ .050 thats not exactly a smallish cam.

what am i missing? why is his peak torque so low in the RPM range? Shouldnt the stealthram be peaking torque around 5,000 rpms?

gixxer9

Yeah king, I found that odd also. All I can think of are the small 1 5/8 headers and the not too great TFS G1 heads. It all has to do with the combination of parts and this motor just was weird. I'm still waiting on my fuel lines (damnit) but I will spend time at the local dyno and post my numbers.

gixxer9

I'm sorry evrybody but I'm still waiting for my AN fuel line kit for the stealth ram from http://www.supersportperformance.com/ . It has been a couple of weeks and I am very unhappy with this lack of service. My 30th anniversary camaro seats came in today ( I just bought them a few days ago) from tennessee. I promise to document every problem or flaw with the install of the stealthram, if any, as soon as I get my damn fuel line kit.

BuckeyeROC

The link to the article doesn't work for me, so I'll just ask, was the car dynoed an auto? If so, the 2850 tq peak could have been where the tq converter flashed to.

Nitromethane126

Check your email, our response to GIXXER9 was as follows:

"The fuel lines were ordered directly from Earls, they are all special order pieces, n usually Earl ships special orders via UPS 2nd Day Air. Why you haven't got them yet is beyond me, I'll get our WD to chase it up with Earl's in the morning as they're closed right now."

I find it funny how the first thing people do is jump to the message boards with threats of bad publicity if something goes wrong - I'm sorry you haven't received the fittings yet, the order was placed with Earl's, it would be nice if people contacted us in an attempt to resolve these problems rather than publicly complaining before we even know it never arrived.

Thankyou,
Mike
SuperSportPerformance.com

gixxer9

Buckeye, use this link to read the article.
http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...holleystealth/

gixxer9

Nitromethane, how about putting your company's phone number on your website. Very shady not to have your phone number listed. Just a serious recommendation. By the way, these forums are for consumers to ask questions, get help, give help, and recommend products and services. That is why when someone is mistreated or poorly serviced, word gets out. Also, list on your site that the fuel line kits are not a stocked item so someone doesn't get misled into thinking that they are on the way when your site says they were shipped. If I had known that they were just ordered by your company and drop shipped to the consumer, I would have ordered directly or from summit myself.

Kevin Gray

This is a quote from the “Do Engine Simulators Really Work?” section of the article.

“If you look at where the estimated torque output from the modified TPI combination is concentrated, then consider the converter’s torque multiplication factor (as seen in the graph): it becomes clear why the IROC had traction problems with that intake.”

There were problems with the graphs, or with the allotted space and they were not included in the article. The above reference is somewhat confusing looking at a bunch of numbers and would have made more sense with visuals of the EA simulation and DynoJet pull. Also, “as seen in the DynoJet graph” was edited to read “as seen in the graph” since the visuals and their captions were not included. The captions that went along with the visuals referenced the torque multiplication factor of the torque converter seen at 2850 rpm. Actual peak torque for this HSR combo is between 4400 – 4600 rpm,,,, just as the simulation estimated.

gixxer9

Good point Kevin.

gixxer9

I have started the intake swap but still have not received the AN line kit. It appears that the intake will fit under an IROC hood without clearancing.

gixxer9

Well after 27 days I finally got my fuel line kit! I am going to finish the stealth ram install this week and I plan on going to Byron dragway next saturday to get timeslips.

mrr23

hey gixxer9 if you haven't already go to www.stealthram.com and submit your car and info so i can add it to the site. click the HSR CARS section to see what info is needed.

gixxer9

mrr23, I will do that as soon as I'm done with the install. It is taking this long only because I have been very busy. I plan to finish the install on Friday or Saturday.

clippjr8

i think you will be very satisfied with the stealth ram and that combo. I put the stealth ram on my combo and picked up 2 tenths with no other tuning. the stealth replaced the tpis big mouth intake and long tube runners. im starting to think that the tpis stuff is over priced and way under par. im still running the zz-9 cam for now, but we will see what times i run when i put the ported vette heads on. good luck with the stealth ram, the install is not bad at all.

gixxer9

I'm about 90% done with the swap. I just need to mount the remote coil and do the fuel lines. Most of my time was spent finding adapters and fittings for the temp sensors, oil pressure senders, and vacuum fittings. I'm getting excited being this close to starting it up!

92 zzz28

I think you will be loving your HSR. I am and I don't even have it tuned yet. With the new cam and everything else, it is taking me a while to find the time to burn some chips and take some readings. But the thing runs so much different. It pulls like a madman to 4500 and it still tries to keep going, I don't let yet since my tune is not very good...Anyway, good luck with your project, and post your results when you finish er up...

gixxer9

The IROC is alive! I have not done the maiden test drive yet but it definitely sounds better. It also revs cleaner and quicker when I turn the linkage. I noticed that it does touch my hood though. I don't know if my poly motor mounts have anything to do with that. I also do not know why the exhaust is louder unless it is from the intake finally providing enough flow for my motor.

gixxer9

I killed my trans on the test drive! I managed to do a couple of good pulls first. It has the seamless powerband of an LS1 except it keeps pulling harder even at 6700 indicated RPMs! It also does insane burnouts but now slips after 4700 rpm or so. I will take it to the local dyno when I get the trans swapped. I also forgot my timing light at work so I had to time it by ear.