Batass

Ever since my build ive had issues with my msd stuff. Constantly chasing it around. Constantly retuning. Id like to go back to the factory hei. Im also ditching my blower for nitrous. I just dont need the power all the time anymore. Id like a box to control timing during squirts. 100-250 shots. Is the coil in an hei up to it?

pete0013

I would not recommend that you go back to an hei ( at least a factory style), since they are compasitive discharge they can only build accurate spark to something like 5500 rpm, that is why most people go to a multi- spark ignition box like the msd. In my recent experience with the summit bullet hei the ignition control modules have a tendency of going bad, also the capacitor is crap. If you are set on one though I would go the pertronics flamethrower series that have programmable advance and rev limiter, that is my 2 cents.

Good luck

Apeiron

HEI isn't capacitive discharge, it's inductive.

An MSD box is capacitive discharge.

Batass

Ive had alot of issues with msd stuff. My billet distributor is corroded after only about 30 hrs of use. From what ive read its common and due to a poor vent. Would a factory hei with a box have that same issue since it wasnt built for the high spark energy? Or should I just try to fix my msd distributor?

Apeiron

How bad is the corrosion?

Batass

Looks like when someone hasnt changed their cap and rotor in ten years. Pickup wheel looks like it sat at the bottom of the ocean.

Apeiron

If it doesn't present a mechanical issue then it's nothing to worry about. Just change the cap and rotor.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

http://performancedistributors.com/p...-distributors/

Besides being more reliable, your car will probably go faster.

Batass

Its misfiring above 3500. Timing is good. Wires are good. Changed coil and location. Swapped boxes and wire routing. When I put the hei in, it runs clean but power is lower.

Those dui dizzys are nice but pricey. I need to run a box for timing/nitrous control so it seems like a waste to invest in one.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

No excuses.

Just call em.

pete0013

My mistake, got them backwards

86LG4Bird

iTrader: (1)

For an all-in-one ignition box for nitrous control.....window switch, spark retard, rev limiter,.....check out the Mallory 685. I ran it for years with the 150 shot on my LT1.

FRMULA88

I would be less inclined to blame the product,
make sure you have the real deal and not fake MSD equipment.

even then I would still pay attention to the environment the car is being kept in.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

My MSD rusted like crazy too. I have bought new parts to rebuild it, but it was litterally just sitting outside for about a year, in the car and rusted to crap.

FRMULA88

sitting for a year outside... in Milford... outside not moving for 1 year & exposed snow, rain, humidity, condensation. but you blame the product.?

How about spraying the inside of the dist cap with WD-40?


My MSD 6AL is 16 years old. pro-billet dist is about 3... no issues the car sits inside a garage when not used.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

I have a garage now, but then I didn't. Back when I was in highschool I had the old stock HEI sit for a year with no use in Needham, make climate, and then did a cap and rotor just for the hell of it when I was getting it back on the road... again stored outside. Nothing. Perfect. A car should be able to sit outside with rain, snow etc hitting it and not have the internals of its ignition rust to ****.

So yet, I do blame the product. 100%.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

Cars live outside. GM Distributors live outside in cars for months and months on dealer lots. There are people that drive and park their old chevy trucks outside year round and don't have this problem. You shouldn't have to keep your car in a climate-controlled environment to keep your distributor from rusting up. That's absurd.

FRMULA88

Car may " live " outside but when driven on a daily basis or just used on a regular basis the parts move, heat up, and dry. Condensation does not have chance to set in and do real damage.

Cars parked on dealer lots today have coil packs, which are not the same as a cap and rotor which are prone to condensation damage.

By the was surface rust on the advance mechanism, weights. etc is nothing to be shocked about.

"Old trucks" like a shop truck or truck for plowing snow? Granted they may be parked but only for a few months. at some point in the year they get driven.


Keep in mind you may also be dealing with counterfeit parts.

The quality is not same. There was a great article about this, MSD was one of big ones being ripped off.

FRMULA88

“All the MSD counterfeits came off the Internet. We haven’t had any problems from authorized distributors. Don’t buy from an unknown fly-by-night operator.”
— Russell Stephens, MSD


Read more: http://www.hotrod.com/feature_storie...#ixzz2vqQkKZAo

bestracing

The older MSD boxes are great and I have a 6T that is 22 years old and a 7AL that is a pretty old as well and both still work great

I have a newer 6AL that I put into my 86 and after 3 years it just stopped working. Turns out that the solder on a few components had pulled away from the part's leads, especially on the cap. I could put pressure on the cap and get the ignition box to work. Wound up having to rework a lot of solder joints. BTW I did mount the box using their anti-vibration mounts.

Now after seeing other posts on the internet about MSD ignitions and I'm in the electronics industry I wonder if MSD has gone RoHS, No Lead, compliant.

FRMULA88

I am more inclined to believe the OP and other people having problems are victims of counterfeit parts.

I am a long time subscriber of Hot Rod, that article last summer was eye opening.


This article’s opening photos depict what appear to be two identical MSD 6AL ignition boxes. But the one on the right is a fake, one of the most elaborate counterfeit performance product rips so far. “We found it first in the repair department,” reports MSD President Russell Stephens. “It looked so authentic at first glance! But close inspection revealed it wasn’t ours. We ended up giving the customer a real product so they’d tell us where the phony came from. It turned out everything came off the Internet.”

Read more: http://www.hotrod.com/feature_storie...#ixzz2vqvMMbLO

FRMULA88

Working with the FBI and its attorneys to ID the bad guys, MSD made buys of the phony products. Still an ongoing investigation, so far one Malaysian national was caught, tried, and convicted here in the U.S. But the chain ultimately leads back to Asia. Stephens admits that “so far we’ve never got to the original overseas source in a convictable manner.” Ultimately, MSD redesigned the packaging, then revised the entire product design and appearance, replacing the original MSD 6AL (PN 6420) with the current MSD Digital 6AL (PN 6425) box with a new cast-in logo. There still may be some legitimate original-type MSD 6AL inventory left in the retail pipeline, so these photos show some of the differences between the real product and the fake. If you are unfortunate enough to be stuck with the latter, MSD and the FBI want to know.



The counterfeiters committed one glaring error. All known phonies to date have the same serial number: 682013. It’s as if you made perfect $100 bills, but put the same number on all of them!


Read more: http://www.hotrod.com/feature_storie...#ixzz2vqvnwQUp

FRMULA88

When the cheap, inferior copy fails, usually there’s no warranty protection. Obviously, the maker of the real part is also a victim and under no obligation to back-up a counterfeit, knock-off, or copycat. And good luck getting any satisfaction from that amorphous online seller.

But there’s also more subtle damage “behind the screen”: Problems with counterfeits and knock-offs ultimately erode confidence in the real product

I have a question for the OP. Did you send your failed MSD parts back to MSD for warrantee inspection & free replacement? If so what was the outcome?

Rather than blaming the product consider the source and "edumacate" yourself.. MSD is a stand up company that is behind their products 100% that is unless the product you have is "a fake".

And if it is a fake they still want to know about it so they can track them down.

Good Luck !

Read more: http://www.hotrod.com/feature_storie...#ixzz2vqxsb73q

Scorpner

iTrader: (4)

Wow, I didn't know that. Thanks for the link, I'm passing this on.

bestracing

Yes and they have been for me as well in the past. Very good article and I didn't know they had a huge problem with counterfeits. My box was out of warranty so I fixed it myself. Also according to the article my box isn't fake.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

Who said anything about cars today? Almost every car and truck that came with an HEI sat on a dealer lot at some point for some indeterminate time period. I dont think the dealers had issues with brand new 1979 Z28 distributors rusting up while they sat out in Florida humidity for months before someone bought them.

Im not saying the proposed mechanism for corrosion is incorrect, this is obviously what happened. But I'm saying it indicates a fault of the quality of the parts, not a fault on the owner's usage. Saying to someone their distributor failed because they parked their car outside is insane.

Batass

I bought my parts from a local dealer that builds dirt race stuff. Before I check out my distributor im going to make a shielded harness to verify im not somehow getting interference.

First my oil coil leaked out the top and soaked the coil wire. Ive had lots of performance and starting consistency issues that disappear when I put the hei back in. The only part of my msd setup that hasnt been replaced is the distributor. I need to do more investigating before I really start to point fingers but it has been my experience that factory stuff is the most reliable and best engineered.

datraum

I have an MSD 6a box I bought in 2002 and a Probillet distributor I bought in 2005 in my car and they work perfect. Last February I bought a Probillet distributor for my truck to replace the factory one and out of the box it would not fire. I called MSD and got nowhere with them so I called Summit and they sent me a new one. 6 months later it goes out. I have always been a huge fan of MSD but it seems the quality has gone way down hill. Since I bought the parts direct from Summit there is no reason to believe I had counterfeit parts and I will not be buying anymore MSD products.

Batass

The quality of alot of things have seemed to have gone downhill lately. Decreasing quality control saves ALOT of money.

Datraum-Maybe the pickup coil went bad in yours? Im not sure what would cause mine to severely retard timing at about 3k rpms

datraum

The distributor I had problems with was on my Ford Bronco. The ignition module is built in and went bad both times. MSD wouldn't sell the module by itself and a factory one wouldn't work. And on top of it all, O'reillys wouldn't take the MSD unit as a core.

Batass

So msd doesnt like anyone but themselves servicing their stuff or what?

bestracing

O'Reilly's won't take an MSD distributor as a core because it can't be rebuilt as a rebuilt/reman "OEM" replacement.