DanielWinkler

Hey everyone, I just bought my first third gen car today, i was thrilled. I got an 89 Firebird, red, with a brand new 350 installed 12k miles ago, and a factory installed tranny 8k miles ago, with reciepts for everything. Well, I have the car about an hour, I'm having a blast, and I go home to show my mom. Well, I was parking at the curb, and i shifted to reverse, and it stalled. It had actually stalled twice before, when in parking lots, at VERY low RPMs, when i kept it in low RPMs for more than a short while. This car is automatic, but every other car Ive owned since i turned 16 has been stick, so that didn't strike me as odd, I just figured i need to give it more gas, because of the bigger engine. Well, It cranked up the two times in the parking lot. In front of my house, it wouldn't. The lights and everything come on, the headlights work, and they don't even dim when I try to start the car. But the starter doesn't even make a noise. So, my dad gets home, and we push the car up my driveway into the garage (not a fun task, we have a steep driveway). I called my mechanic friend, and he said to jack it up and tap on the starter with a hammer while my dad tries to start it, its probably a bad connection. Well, as I start to jack it up, on the A-frame, my dad tries to start it, and it starts right up. We were dumbfounded, so I called my friend, and he said when the frame was raised, it probably made the starter make contact with the loose wire, and just to check that out. I said ok, thats easy enough... but now the check engine light is on! Has anyone heard of anything like this, and does anyone have any suggestions! I spent all of my money on this car, and don't really have money to spend on a mechanic. Thanks

sellmanb

I agree with your mechanic, it was probably a heat soaked starter.

It sounds like your idle needs adjusted. Check the Tech Articles section on this site for "Adjusting IAC and TPS" , and adjust those. It's a fairly simple process once you figure out which one is which

The starter will need to get some heat shielding around it to stop it, or you'll need to get a new starter. The best permanent fix is to get a new mini-starter (one from a 93-97 V8 Camaro is perfect).

DanielWinkler

Wow, thanks man. Yeah, I kinda figured I would just need a new starter... About the stalling, it happened again, and I realized this - it only happens when the car is in reverse, and i am holding the brake, and easing on the brake. If i just shift to reverse, and let it roll, its fine. If I ease off the brake in reverse, it dies out on me. So looks like you were probably right about the idle, too One more question though, why would the check engine light be coming on? And is the fact that the 350 isnt a TPI, but seems to be a TBI, a problem? The engine isnt the original, he bought it from an engine shop. It's a 350, fuel injected, and has a large round air cleaner like a TBI. Is the idle adjustment procedure gonna be the same?

sellmanb

the IAC and TPS should be the same procedure.

The check engine light might be on because of the swap. If he swapped in a 350 TBI, from a 305 TPI wiring harness and computer, then the codes would be flying off the wall.

If all that they did was take the 305 TBI, put a 350 short block on there and call it a day w/ old 305 TBI setup, then the codes should still apply.

There's a quick and easy way to find out what codes are stored in your computer. All that it involves is two eyes, ability to count to 9, and a paper clip (stick with me here).

The ALDL is a little box that's below your dash and steering column, it will look like the picture below.

What you need to do is take a paper clip and bend it so that it has the two sides sticking out. Then put your key to the "ON" position (without starting the car) and put one side of the paper clip in the "A" terminal on the ALDL, and put the other in the "B" terminal in the ALDL.

Then watch your SES light flash. It should flash once, then twice real fast, then pause, then do it again 2 more times. The one flash means "1" the two quick ones mean "2" put them together and that makes code "12" . It tells you the code that it has stored 3 times. Then it will flash whatever other codes it has stored. The code "12" is something that it will flash every time that you try to get the codes, it just means that the ECM is working, so dont be worried about that.

After you get the other codes come back here and post what you found and we'll see if we can help

sellmanb

guess the picture would help

TraviZ

iTrader: (2)

once the car is in good tune, get to work on those TBI mods, they do work!

DanielWinkler

Funny thing - the light went off by itself, and never came back on. And it ran fine for a day. I just now got back from another little incident, however. I was pulling out of a parking lot, and while in reverse, holding the brake and easing it out, it stalled again. It started right back up, and i went somewhere else. When I was parking, in very low RPMs, easing off the brake, it stalled once more. When I came back, the car wouldnt even try to start up. Same thing as the other day, the starter wouldnt even turn. But this time, something different happened. I couldn't take the key out. Now this really made me mad, because I was stuck in Houston heat, in my car, no air circulation, trying to get it started. I called this guy I work with, who happens to be a mechanic, and he luckily was on the same side of Houston, so he came by. He fiddled with the tilt, and after about 10 minutes, got the key out. Then, he jacked up the car, and told me to turn the key to the on position. He got under it, and did something with a screwdriver and hammer, and it started up. He said it had to be something between the igntion and the starter, because when he bypassed all that, it started right up. He also said it needed to have the timing adjusted, and said maybe it could use a tune up. I guess I'll take it in to this shop I know of, have the freon recharged, get a tune-up, find the igntion thing that is messing up, and have the timing adjusted. I'm just scared to find out how much all that's gonna cost me. Thanks guys!

sellmanb

Sounds like a great plan. Also sounds like a great mechanic if he's willing to come out to you and help yah out.

I would wait a couple paychecks to have your freon recharged... You will have to have your AC system converted to R134A from R12. It'll cost you a bit more than I'd pay. I know that at my work we charge 90 just to hook up the A/C machine, and then another 40 / lb of freon.

So expect atleast that much, plus what they'll charge you to convert the system over.

DanielWinkler

Ouch! They can't just recharge it with R12?

sellmanb

R12 is no longer in production.

DanielWinkler

Hmmm. How much does it cost to have it switched over, does anyone know? I'm kind of strapped for cash right now, so I'm trying to figure out what repairs I can do now, which ones I should wait on. I think I narrowed down the problem on my car - When I parked it, the car actually wouldn't turn off! I couldn't turn the key to remove it, and the engine wouldnt stop running. I messed with the tilt, while turning the key, and it eventually turned. I'm thinking there is a switch or a wire that has come loose or isnt making good contact in the steering column, and it's causing the key to lock up, fan and a/c to stay on, even when I turn the car off, etc. Does this sound like anything that has happened to anyone?

sellmanb

You could go to the junkyard and grab a new steering column, and then go and get a new ignition cylinder and have it keyed to your original key.

TraviZ

iTrader: (2)

R12 is still produced, you just need a license to buy it lol.

Nixon1

And it's ***-awful expensive... Our shop won't order it anymore...we only sell the 123a conversion now. Trying to phase it out. The only 12 we have is what we recover from peoples systems doing the 134a conversion.

SBlackfoot

Also try wiggling the gearshift when the key doesn't want to come out. It won't go into the "lock" position if the tranny isn't fully in park.

DanielWinkler

Yeah, I tried wiggling/banging on about anything I could think of haha. Well, I took it to this shop, he looked at it, said it was probably the key and tumbler, and the gear at the back of the tumbler. Unfortunately, hes charging me 200-250 to replace it, and my mechanic friend says that sounds high, although he said it probably costs more because of the little black anti-theft button thing on the key. To be honest, I don't even care if he over-charges me, I just want my new ride to work! Anyways, I'm also having him adjust the timing and everything, so hopefully that fixes the stall. As for the stall, even if it isnt fixed, it only happens when I'm starting the car and backing up, so if it stalls, but will start right back up and doesnt stick, I'm fine with that.

DanielWinkler

Got the lock cylinder changed, and timing adjusted (timing was off 4 degrees). The key problem is fixed, but unfortunately, it still surges at idle and stalls occasionally in reverse. I'm thinking it's a vacuum hose leak somewhere. Does that sound plausible to anyone?

Firebreed

Sounds real plasable to me, i know i found a huge leak comin off of my manifold on my car, pluged the sucker up and im running preatty smothly now.

Eats5.0's

iTrader: (1)

Yep,, and vacuum leaks are real fun to find...( note of sarcasm there). WD-40 sprayed around works pretty well at finding some of the harder ones.

Firebreed

And make sure you look over you HOLE engine, the vacume sorce on my engine is behind my carb, and infrount of my Dizzy, and I cant seem to figure out to the life of me what it is shoule be connected to! (dont mean to hijack the topic either)

91 GTA WI

sounds wierd but for the stalling your torque converter maybe locking up and killing you engine while your foot is on the brake. had it happen in a truck i had when ever you would put it in gear with your foot on the brake it would kill.