Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Yes the AC works, it has been converted to 134A by a previous owner and it blows nice and cold. I left it sealed for the engine swap. I have a starting bin burned and in it now, I will fire it back up and set the timing tomorrow. Here is my tuning thread in DIY Prom:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...ml#post5792377

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Car is at the exhaust shop now.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

The exhaust it done, the car is much louder. Timing is set by ear, I didn't have enough time to tinker with it. Driving it, the car has a bog then once over that it accelerates fine. I didn't hammer on it yet.One thing concerning me is that it is wanting to idle at about 2000 rpms. Any idea what could be causing that?

RFmaster

Spaceboy
1) Set the timing to match base SA as in BIN (EST plug open) with a timing light - no ifs, buts or whatever! Got have that right.
2) reset IAC - procedure is posted on the TGO. If this does not help you have a vacuum leak the size of Ohio.
3) Avoid the temptation to stomp on it - you have long ways to go.

//RF

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Thanks for the directions RF!

I can avoid the temptation to stomp it, it is just a fun car for me.

I was trying to set the timing before taking it to the shop and I dialed the light back and it was showing 25 degrees advanced. That was when I just set it by ear to get it up there. Only when I got home did I realize I forgot to unplug the connection for setting the timing. ><

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Well I went out to mess with it tonight and it would not start. I finally got it to hit off of some ether after playing with the timing and it is pouring gas out of the injectors. I don't know what normal spray pattern looks like but this was washing down the butterflies. I am thinking I have too much fuel going to it, I am only running 10 psi of pressure right now. After I shut it off, it would not restart. I think it is flooding.

RS-Chevy-SS

Well what's the verdict? Its also possible that your cranking fueling is off in the prom. Is the prom still setup with 55pph injectors in mind?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Well I think my problem is the injectors. I put the 305 prom back in it and had the same result. The injectors seem to be dripping fuel, not spraying. Could I have put the pod together wrong or are my new delco injectors bad?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Okay, I think my initial diagnosis is wrong. I believe the fuel pump went out. I put the 305 fuel pod on and I got it to run. I did the IAC reset procedure and was trying to set the timing when it started stalling and it finally died and would not restart. I turned the key off and waited a few seconds and turned it back on. I could hear the fuel pump relay kick on but could not hear the pump run. I need to put my tpi pump in anyway, now I need more free time to get it in.

Okay a question on setting the timing. Where is the connector you disconnect? I thought I had found it but I was still dialing back to 20-25 degrees of advance. When I went to see what the tach was reading it was dead. What I had unplugged was the tach.

Where is the connector for setting the timing?!

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Hahahaha, figured it out! For sure this time. You see, I have been running the fuel low in anticipation of changing out the pump. Well it actually run out of gas while idling. I could edit my post above to save myself some embaressment but then I rob someone like me of the opportunity to learn from my mistake.

I also was able to locate the esc connector. It is just ahead of the HVAC box in the main harness coming out of the passenger's side. Base timing is now set to 10* advance.

Now I just need to swap fuel pods and proms back and I am once again on track.

RS-Chevy-SS

10 base? Living life on the edge. I run at 0 base and let EBL do everything.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

The computer knows it is 10* initial so it isn't being added on top of the timing table.

RFmaster

As long as bin has 0 or 10 deg and it matches actual set timing of the distributor it does not matter. In older days 6 to 8 deg was a norm. This was done to allow engine to fire-up quickly. 10 deg on a hot day may cause starter kick - back on a high compression engine, but unlikely with L31. ECM controls timing once engine RPM is greater then 400 RPM.

//RF

//RF

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Well the motor is hard to start but once it does it settles into a smooth idle. Once the motor warms up however I get a surging idle. FI is frustrating, a carb is so much simpler. :/

Oh and I can't connect to do any data logging.

RS-Chevy-SS

Why cant you connect? Sounds like your crank fueling is off along with idle fueling. This is where EBL is so handy.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I dont know why it will not connect now, it just keeps saying DA Not Connected. My SES light doesnt work either, I think the previous owner may have pulled the bulb. I am going to look at that tomorrow.

If I manually down shift it and jump the rpms over 3k, it runs great.

I cannot find crank fueling in tunerpro either ><

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Here is the main cranking AFR table for the '8746 ECM:

Crank Afr vs Coolant @ $36F

The title may be different so search on the address in Tuner Pro for the table entry.

RBob.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Thanks RBob. I am going to change out my coolant temp sensor in the intake. Doing a search it looks like that can cause some wonky things if it is bad. My agenda after work is to check the SES bulb, swap the coolant sensor and try to get reconnected.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Well some progress, nothing major but forward motion regardless.

The good, swapped the coolant temp sensor

The bad, did not help

The ugly, the drivers side injector is not spraying well under the timing light. The pass side looks great but the drivers has some dribbling in with the spray. I have ordered a set of flow matched 55 lbs injectors that I will be swapping in when they arrive.

My IAC connector had a broke clip on it as well as the wire retainer for it in the back and my replacement housing came in today. It took about two minutes to depin and install in the new housing with the proper tool.

I also pulled the gauge cluster and as I suspected the CEL socket was pulled. I luckily had some spare sockets laying around and installed one and now I have a working CEL. With the key on it blinks once then stays on which I believe means the prom is reading and not the calpak so that is a good sign.

I have done a lot of reading on tuning a larger cam (not saying mine is huge but it is a bigger cam) and I now have some ideas on how to tackle my idle. I also have a hunch on my connection issue, I suspect I am having com port issues. I will work on that next.

I have the day off tomorrow and my plan is to install my TPI pump and get my fuel pressure up to 18-20 lbs.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Alright, I got tunerpro talking to the car again. I had to reinstall virtual com port serial drivers and set tunerpro to the com port of the adapter.

RS-Chevy-SS

Do you get the same spray issues with the stock pod? You are going to have to run near 30 psi with 55pph injectors to feed that motor. Even then i don't think you'll have enough fuel at wot.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I don't know if the 305 pod has that issue, I didn't check before I swapped it back.

I got the pump swapped out, it took me 4.5 hours solo. I put two gallons of premium in the tank and fired it up. The regulator was reading 45 psi, lol. I turned it down to 20 and rechecked the timing.

The car is like a different car now. It starts easier and revs smoother. I can't take it out yet, I'm not going to pack the kids in a car I don't trust yet.

Between the car running better and getting tunerpro connected my moral about the car is much improved. I wonder if what I thought was a rich condition was actually a lean one.

RS-Chevy-SS

Possible. How is the pattern now with the new pump? Also did you go with acdelco for the pump?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I did check the pattern with the timing light and I could not see any dribbling but it is light outside. I put in a spectra pump, I have used them to great success before and I trust the brand. It got a new sock on it also. The pump is not something I would cheap out on due to the difficulty of the job.

RS-Chevy-SS

Meh I'm apprehensive about spectra for fuel pumps. Had the airtex brand tbi pump go out on me at least 3 times. I went acdelco but mine is sounding like a diesel right now in extremely hot weather.

Could of been that you didnt have enough pressure/volume for the injectors

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Lol, you are making a better case for spectra than ac Delco!

RS-Chevy-SS

Yeah i may have gotten a bad one but fast355 says its normal. We will see if yours does it. Needs to be 90*<

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Well I was able to actually drive it and get gas. I did a data log and I cannot figure out how to view history tables. It is blank, there are no tables to view.

RS-Chevy-SS

What did you log with?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Tunerpro, the ADX I am using did not have any history tables in it. I found a how to guide to make them and I was able to create a BLM table but I cannot make one for knock.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Here is a screen cap

RS-Chevy-SS

Looks lean in some areas. Did you go wot already?

Odd i didn't have that issue with the adx. Make a switch?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

No WOT yet. What do you mean make a switch, a different adx? Are you using the $61 mask? What ecm, 746? What adx are you using?

RS-Chevy-SS

Would need to fire up my laptop

Edit: before ebl i was using the $61v3 xdf and $61 ads. Now i just use the ebl xdf since i dont log with tuner pro anymore

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Those are the ones I am using. I drove it to work and logged on the way home. I am using the spreadsheet that is floating around to make adjustments. I cannot log knock so I dialed it back to the vortec timing table. I do not trust that much advance when I cannot monitor it. I have a minor surge at idle that I believe is due to the overlap on the cam. It is only about 200 rpm but it is noticeable. After some reading I tried a repair for it and I will see if it works tomorrow. The car seems to keep pushing after I let off of the throttle, I do not understand that. It is like the cruise is on but it is not.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Throttle follower (TF), there are IAC parameters that can be adjusted. Note that adjusting the TF will affect emissions if an IM240 loop is done.

RBob.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Thanks RBob, I have found it in the bin. Do I want to raise or lower the IAC steps to reduce the pushing?

Is there any way to transpose the tables, swap the columns and rows?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I am having a surging issue at idle. I have searched about how to fix this and round stuff related to ebl but not the 746 ecm. Any one successfully get rid of the surge? It doesn't do it in open loop and my O2 readings swing pretty far at idle, I believe it to be an overlap issue. Can the ECM be set up for open loop idle?

RS-Chevy-SS

Does the o2 swing only at idle? Did you verify injectors aren't dribbling after all?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

Actually my replacement injectors came in today and I will install them soon. Yes it is only swinging in idle and only in closed loop.

What should the TPS voltage read without giving any throttle? I am getting .71

92rsvortec350

iTrader: (8)

.50 - .76 is the norm.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I have resolved the surge at idle in closed loop, the LT4 hot cam sounds awesome


I am having a problem getting the lean pop out on tip in. I believe it to be a lean pop and not too much timing due to how conservative my timing table is.

I am running the vortec timing table and have scaled back areas of knock. I believe I am getting phantom knocks due to my exhaust Y-pipe tapping my subframe connector on the passenger side. I need to drop it down and either ding the pipe around it or remove the arm on the connector and relocate it.

I have yet to get into heavy acceleration tuning, staying easy on it until I have the lower end of the tune more nailed down.

My BLMs below 50Kpa don't seem to change no matter what I do in the tune but above that it looks really good. Any advice on the lower Kpa BLMs and the popping through the throttle body?

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

The pop is probably lack of timing. Might also be lack of AE fuel. Increase all but the lowest TPS and MAP AE values 50%. Should get you closer.

The reason your lower RPM BLMs are not moving is they are maxed out. may take a few times of pulling fuel to no longer bemaxed out. the 268 cammed truck with the Holley TBI I tuned was the same way. Lost alot of idle vacuum and was rich at idle and just off-idle but was lean lean lean under load.

RFmaster

In post 242 BLM's around idle region are at 108 - so it's clear that VE table values in the idle region need to be trimmed 108 = rich. That will take care of CL at idle. As Fast355 mentioned transition from idle to load will require additional TPS and MAP AE. Sorry, I am forgetting that you are working with a stock 7747 ECM.

Reduce VE values between 800 and 1200RPM by 20 to 50 KPA by 10%. Reload Bin file, run and data log - see if the BLMs in 'the square' begin increasing.

//RF

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I made the adjustments you both recommended. First the pop on tip in is much improved. It is still there with light tip in but if I press the throttle harder I do not get it.

On the BLMs, the numbers have gone up about 2-3 on average in the square.

Thanks guys.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I forgot to include that I did have one fit of bad sputter that set a code 43 at part throttle tip in.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

The forced knock test failed... If using an early BCC here is an ESC_Done patch to eliminate that test.

RBob.

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I cannot apply the patch because my laptop is 64 bit and will not run the As11 assembler. I cannot find a work around for this that works. DosBox won't run it, am I doomed to failed force knock tests, lol?

Spaceboy1980

iTrader: (6)

I may have found a work around but I am stuck on the offset for applying the patch. I cannot find any info about it, I have read the patch stickies and threads but I just can't find it. Can I get some help please?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

No need to assemble the patch, the s19 file is included in the zip. Post #55 (near end of thread) has a Windows console version of the patch utility. Use that in a command window.

The patch itself is in post #35: code43.zip

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...thod-demo.html

RBob.