GTA1990

iTrader: (1)

Happy holidays crew

Have been reading about the miracles of panel bonding and how it can be considered stronger than welding and doesn't weaken steel/ promote rusting like welding might (sidebar, I'm practicing for a career in politics hence my non-committal statements).

So got me thinking, provided the metal surfaces are suitably prepped and clamped for the requisite period to ensure the product cures, structural panel bond sounds to me like it could be a good alternative to welding subframe connectors

Just wanted to get thoughts for us driveway warriors out there for whom welding isn't that accessible

Chopski

iTrader: (1)

I have panel bonded my replacement battery tray in and it's great but personally I would not use it where twisting may be an issue.

GTA1990

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the pointer

reading up or torsional rigidity of panel bond, 3m’s website does talk to limitations of twisting/ peeling type scenarios which I suppose at least for the front subframe connections is a consideration

i’ll keep reading

91ls1t56

I'm having a hard time understanding what would generate a question like this and why nuts and bolts aren't the answer ? Unless you are considering using the panel bond with the DSE connectors.

GTA1990

iTrader: (1)

a cocktail of import duties and shipping making UMI weld on connectors the least cost prohibitive option when landed in the UK (others look to cost more to ship than the product itself..) coupled with welding not being that accessible and a slight cynicism toward 3rd party welders correctly loading / aligning the chassis prior to welding.

UMI weld on connectors and their connection points don't look to lend themselves to nuts and bolts (to complement the panel bond if that's what you meant)

91ls1t56

Big bummer on the shipping out costing the product. I did mean nuts and bolts instead of the panel bond. I have seen demonstrations where the panel bond holds firm and the sheetmetal tears and do think it is an interesting approach to your circumstances.

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (14)

Here's my feelings on this. I believe panel bond could work just find in this application. However for it to do so, the areas of connection must be perfectly aligned and formed to match, which is the problem and why its not going to work with off the shelf parts.

Now, if you were going to build a custom set and could spend the time forming the connections to match the body, then i see no reason panel bond couldn't be used.

Lonnie P

Panel bonding works for lightly loaded parts with a high surface area... think a 1" wide x 10ft long bonding area around the perimeter of a quarter panel. This panel is flexible & will give somewhat to keep from tearing the joint apart. This can be stronger than a small spot weld every 4-6", but do not confuse this strength as compared to a continuous weld around the full perimeter.

Now compare this to a frame connector which has maybe a 4" square at each end to attach & hold thousands of pounds of stress.
Different applications require different methods.

Bolt on connectors do not work well as the fastening method only grips at the bolt, similar to the spot weld mentioned above, except with frame connectors you cannot use enough bolts to make a rigid connection... maybe if there were 20 bolts holding it in place along it's full length it would start to make sense, but not a few bolts at each end.
Bolts rely on clamping force & unless the 2 parts are very rigid (which your stamped frame isn't), you get limited grip. Also the bolt holes have some slop so the clamping force is all you have for location. You will notice anything structural is typically welded or riveted... rivets expand into the holes to physically remove any play in the connection, which a bolt cannot do.

Moral of the story.... find a good welder or do not waste your time..