blakecharles

Hey,
I been working on my car off and on for a while now. My landlord wants me to move the car so I got some cheap MOOG springs from summit. I tried jacking them up by the ball joint on the a-arms and compressing them...

No matter how much I compress or jack the never go in properly. How are you guys doing this?



I need this done asap and am working with little time. My main reason for using the MOOG in the first places is that I have Deep Dish Y2k's and I don't know if they will rub with drop springs and 2" spacers. Should I just give up and buy drop springs??

FRONT WHEEL SIZE: 18x9.5
FRONT WHEEL OFFSET: 54
REAR WHEEL SIZE: 19x10
REAR WHEEL OFFSET: 65
BOLT PATTERN: 5-120.65
HUB SIZE: 70.3

blakecharles

Here are some pix of what I'm talking about... Here is a pic after the safty chain was removed.

- if I jack the a-arm up to the ball joint, the spring will no seat properly

- the compressor will not compress spring small enough to get into the seat

- if I remove the a-arm, put the spring into the seat and jack up into the car it seats properly but then the car lifts off the jackstands... EVEN WITH THE ls1/t56 IN THE CAR!!

blakecharles

Here is the spindle mod and the Deep Dish Y2k w/ LS1 Brakes that I have been trying to put on the car. Will these rub with drop springs?

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (14)

You will probably need a spring compressor to get them in, some of the moogs are pretty stiff. Also, with those a-arms, I used a piece of household electrical wire, 12-2 romex, to wrap around the sprin and the back of the a-arm pocket to tie/strap things in place until the spring starts to seat. Made life easier.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

You definitely need to compress the spring before you attempt to put that spring in. The big box auto stores usually have those as no cost rentals.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

Here is a thread I found -
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...y-install.html

n1ffer

I also could not get Moogs to fit. I had the correct part number for my application and used an inside compressor and still fought it for two days. Finally the compressor slipped off and the spring popped free and fractured a bone in my hand.

The spring was confirmed many times to be the correct replacement, however it was smaller in diameter and slightly taller than the original springs. My original springs fit in with no compressor. After significant damage to my person, it just made more sense to go with what fit.

Not to say they can't fit, but I think with the taller height it was not going to be easy. If you have dropped your spindles even more from stock, you are fighting an even tougher fight than I had.

Once again, not saying it can't be done and not saying you shouldn't try, but the lowering springs may be an easier approach.

No idea if they will interfere with what you have done. Buy them, try them, and take them back for a refund if they interfere.

Good luck and be SAFE!

blakecharles

Now my problem is that I already spent money on the MOOGs and need the sport-lines too soon send the MOOGs back... smh. I will let you know how it go's.

Kevin Vandevenne

iTrader: (3)

I have almost the same setup on my car, same rims, LS1 brakes etc. I cut about 1/2 coil of the front springs and they went in fine.

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

Read that link. Trust me you can get them in but you need the hook tool compressor and the piece of pipe. You will not get them in any other way. Idk about the Eibach ones either. I heard they are npt as stiff lb wise because stock is 700+lbs and up and the Eibachs are 600lbs If im not mistaken. But from what Ive read they are taller by a little. Trust guys who have done ot this way with that link. Its a fight to get the hooks dead on , but in you driveway on your own this is the best way. I also used a impqct gun to tighten down the compressor tool, makes life easier. And what 86 TA said have a backup plan always when doing this swap. Wrap the coils with small chains or wire or something. The other poster got lucky with a fracture. Ive seen broken jaws. If the tool arms slip, break or any thing the backup plan will safe your ***, or any other body parts that would be in the line of fire. Let us know how it works out. Take care and be safe, dont rush something to get it done. Do it right and safe once.

midnightfirews6

iTrader: (1)

Yep, if you have to you can just cut them and they'll pop right in, just make sure you cut both springs evenly or you'll mess up your x-weights and the car will handle like crap if you drive it with those springs in. Weight jacks and some of the lowering springs with a large drop are easy to install too.

I fought a spring compressor over the summer when I put my Del-alums in my a-arms. Extremely tedious and nerve racking, treat the spring like a loaded gun and keep it pointed away from your face or body. If you can run a safety chain while you wind it down that's even better. You can get the springs in there, though they'll give a hell of a fight... but when you get them in it's a great feeling.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

I had way more luck with a 3 foot crowbar than with a spring compressor... next time I have the springs out Im doing a video. Anchor the crowbar at the top of the spring pocket, far side. Seat the top of the spring where it needs to be in the K-member and hold it there with the crowbar.

Now you push up the crowbar and use your feet to push the spring downhill across the crowbar and into the spring pocket. When it gets to where it needs to be you yank the crowbar out. This will give safety ***** a heart attack but as long as you dont do it barefoot its not dangerous at all. You dont have feet under the spring, just beside it, and your feet being against it will keep it from shooting out somewhere. I messed it up at least a half dozen times before I got it in right, no injuries to speak of. Im terrified of spring compressors and I felt much safer doing it this way.

Just make sure when you are setting up the spring, that you index it right before you start sliding it into place.

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

I cant picture it. Your going to have to video it. Are you leg pressing the spring into place? Never heard of this method. The spring compressor way I Like because I have everything powder coated if it wasnt I wouldnt care about jamming the spring in there. With the compressor less chance to screw ip the paint scheme.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

Actually leg pressing the spring in there is an excellent description. I compress with the crowbar and use the bottoms of my feet to slide the spring down the crowbar and guide it. You get the bar up high enough and the spring will naturally slide "Downhill" and the key is to get the end of the crowbar in the spring pocket area just right so the spring hops off of it and straight into the spring cup.

This method I feel is a lot safer since the spring doesnt get compressed NEARLY as much as with a compressor, but it definitely results in springs bouncing around (harmlessly) if you dont get it right, and if you're trying to figure it out, you wont get it right the first few times. So it most likely will scratch up things here and there.

Lol I made a hilarious picture of how I do it:

dads old blue 9

as you said in your first post ,if you remove the a arm it will seat . well pet on the ball joint (not all the way ) just 3-4 turns drop the rear of the arm (2 mtg bolts ) put the spring in , place the jack under the back bar of the a arm ,not under the spring! jack into place when it gets close enough stick a screwdriver through one of the mtg bolt holes wile you line up the other one for the bolt , bolt it up then work the other one .if you have to move the jack before you remove the screwdriver. use a block of wood with a notch cut in it . this can be very dangerous if the jack isn't lined op properly . so if you begin this way and dont feel good about it ..... then dont do it this way!!!!!!!

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

Ok if your by yourself who is jacking up the a arm when the spring is compressed? Im pretty strong i wouldnt try that. Hook spring compressor, 4 inch piece of pipe, small diameter safty chains and a jack under the a arm. You will have to compress the spring almost closed to get it in there, no way around it. Read that thread again op.

TPI-Formula350-

Looks like you really need a spring compressor. I would think it would be easier if after you install the A-arm to then attach the spindle before attaching to the strut.

pearl_iroc

LOL that actually how I got my GC springs into my UMI A arms, I also had a mini jack under the a arm, had to hold the crow bar in one hand and use the jack with the other

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

It's more or less a 2 person job. As soon as the spring gets hooked into the spring pocket on the a-arm, helper begins jacking it up. And with a 3 foot crowbar it's not hard at all. All you have to do is get the end of hte crowbar hooked at or barely above inside cup of the spring perch in the a-arm (that is the only real tricky part) and just push the crowbar up enough that you can push the spring "Downhill" down the crowbar. 3 foot crowbar is serious leverage, I could compress it WAY farther than is needed to do this. The farther you slide it down the crowbar the more leverage you get against the spring AND the spring doesnt need to be compressed as far. The whole point is just to trap the inside bottom coil above the bump in the middle of the spring pocket while keeping the top of hte spring properly seated in the k-member. As I said, I find it WAY WAY WAY easier and far less terrifying that a spring compressor. A spring compressor literally does store a LOT of energy, and if it slips or breaks it will instantaneously release all of it and I had to really crank down on the thing to fit it in there and it still wouldnt fit right. I hated it and it made me super nervous handling it.

Theoretically, If you can get the a-arm the right angle, the spring will hold itself in place and the spring seat will still be low enough to get it in there. It looks awkward and isnt in there very good, but it will stay, because I was able to do it. It may pop out, but it's barely compressed at that point, not much residual energy stored in the spring when only one side of it is barely compressed. The biggest danger is the weight of the spring scratching something as it falls or falling onto your toe. No real force behind it, just gravity.


The other method of attaching hte balljoint and spindle and taking out the a-arm bolts will also work, but I had a hard time getting mine to do that properly without it just lifting the car. And then you need two jacks for the front and back corners of the a-arm. The spring is a lot closer to that side of the a-arm so its harder to get leverage against it. It can work, but with lighter cars and higher spring rates that are stock height springs it may not be as fool proof.

blakecharles

That pic scares the hell outta me! lol! I managed to get the drivers side in using the 3 1/2 pipe method. It didn't go right in, I had to position one of the compressor arms lower than the other so that the spring compressed at an angle.

It was the angle that allowed the spring to sit in both the A-arm and K-member pockets at the same time. After the spring was installed I was not able to remove the compressor, so I ended up taking it apart inside the spring.

I started installing the Movetech steering linkage and the UMI sleeves.

blakecharles

Makes me wonder how the stock springs where put in, these new MOOG springs are a good bit shorter than what came off the car. Here is a pic before I tried the 3 1/2 pipe method.

DiabloWS6

iTrader: (8)

blakecharles

I went to home depot and got a pipe from the plumbing section (was only $1). I put it on the compressor and it did help but even with this method I was not able to get the other spring in.

In the end I ended up scratching up my freshly powder coated A-Arms so I took them off. I was not able to get the spring to sit into the pocket properly with both the spring and a-arm off the car. Even on the side that I get it on, it just barely fits (no play at all). The stock springs are not as wide and the coil is not as thick so they fit into the a-arm and have room to play. I checked and verified the parts number is right!

Nothing works, I'm leaving the spring in there crooked and bringing the car to a Racing shop around the corner. Or I may end up just buying the drop springs from summit.

blakecharles

I learned my lesson... I have scratched my new a-arms and wasted money on MOOGs when I could have just paid the extra $100 for the drop springs from the start. I been working on this over a week. I'm calling this a loss, springs are in the garbage.

There is no way to make these fit. Thanx everyone!

blakecharles

BUMP!!

Okay,
I ditched the MOOG's. I was never able to get both sides to seat properly into the spring pockets even with the A-Arms off the car. one side just would not fit, spring seemed too wide. I tapped them into the a-arms then could not get them out (fit was tight). I was told that it would have worked fine with stock A-arms (and I think that's true)...

I ended up getting these instead. Should I run these with insulators? If I don't will I be too low??

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

You might want to pull those moogs out of the dumpster before you try to get those in. Those eibach springs are said to be taller than the moogs hut at a lower lb rate. 600 if im not mistaken, the moogs are around 715. Which moogs did you get? Idk if the 305 rs springs are different than the irocz 350 ones. I think they are. I assume the higher lb you go the shorter and fatter the coils. The less lbs you go they get taller and thinner. Make sure. Im not questioning your ability but getting these springs in are not that tough even by yourself. I used the pipe and bought a few heavy duty washers to space it up and down the coils. You have to hit it right at the right spots to get full compression to get them in. Why is it easier with factory a arms vs yours? Wondering because Im putting in umi set and k member in soon. Idk if i was local id stop by to help you out.

L695speed

To all posting on here, I used this thread. Followed it to the letter, and got my Pro Kit springs in within an hour for both sides, I had to dismantle some of it, and reassemble it when done. Including compressing springs I did both sides in that time frame with NO engine in the car. Trans and rear are in but they don't weigh down the front end. See my comments in the thread but I believe I used a 4.5 inch pipe in place of his and got them compressed more than far enough to do the job. The author of this write up did it with Moog 5662 springs I believe. So it can be done. Don't get the shortest springs you can get for these cars just because you can't get them in. Follow the write up to the letter and it will work.

The Pro Kit springs are 714lb fronts, Sport lines are 700. I saw the figures somewhere.