Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
#1
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Car: 1986 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 97 LT1 W/ Alot of goodies.
Transmission: 4L60E W/ Yank SS3600
Axle/Gears: 3.27 9 Bolt BW
Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
So about finished with my Lt1 swap. All that's left is reinstalling the Torque arm and driveshaft.
I was wondering if its worth upgrading both? Or should I use the money on Sfcs and Bilstens instead? I do plan to take my 92 to the track at one point. Would it be a constant thing? Depends. Much rather be a DD. I figure that being said that Sfcs and Bilstens would be the right choice but just wanting some feedback.
As for the driveshaft. They average out at $120. $100 local. My steel one needs a good cleaning and coating as well as a new u-joint so wondered if buying an alum would be
better off. I know most say the car feels more peepier and less vibrations at high speeds.
Also are bilstens the way to go for the price? I have no idea on brand the 92 has on right now. Rears are unused Gr2s which I bought on a sale. Just looking for a smooth ride. I know tires can account a lot into this as well which I'm still loooking at as I type this.
As far as my front suspension goes. All looks good. No worn stuff just dirty.
I was wondering if its worth upgrading both? Or should I use the money on Sfcs and Bilstens instead? I do plan to take my 92 to the track at one point. Would it be a constant thing? Depends. Much rather be a DD. I figure that being said that Sfcs and Bilstens would be the right choice but just wanting some feedback.
As for the driveshaft. They average out at $120. $100 local. My steel one needs a good cleaning and coating as well as a new u-joint so wondered if buying an alum would be
better off. I know most say the car feels more peepier and less vibrations at high speeds.
Also are bilstens the way to go for the price? I have no idea on brand the 92 has on right now. Rears are unused Gr2s which I bought on a sale. Just looking for a smooth ride. I know tires can account a lot into this as well which I'm still loooking at as I type this.
As far as my front suspension goes. All looks good. No worn stuff just dirty.
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Car: 83Z28 HO
Engine: Magnacharged Dart Little M 408
Transmission: G Force 5 speed
Axle/Gears: Moser 9" w/Detroit Trutrac
Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
So about finished with my Lt1 swap. All that's left is reinstalling the Torque arm and driveshaft.
I was wondering if its worth upgrading both? Or should I use the money on Sfcs and Bilstens instead? I do plan to take my 92 to the track at one point. Would it be a constant thing? Depends. Much rather be a DD. I figure that being said that Sfcs and Bilstens would be the right choice but just wanting some feedback.
As for the driveshaft. They average out at $120. $100 local. My steel one needs a good cleaning and coating as well as a new u-joint so wondered if buying an alum would be
better off. I know most say the car feels more peepier and less vibrations at high speeds.
Also are bilstens the way to go for the price? I have no idea on brand the 92 has on right now. Rears are unused Gr2s which I bought on a sale. Just looking for a smooth ride. I know tires can account a lot into this as well which I'm still loooking at as I type this.
As far as my front suspension goes. All looks good. No worn stuff just dirty.
I was wondering if its worth upgrading both? Or should I use the money on Sfcs and Bilstens instead? I do plan to take my 92 to the track at one point. Would it be a constant thing? Depends. Much rather be a DD. I figure that being said that Sfcs and Bilstens would be the right choice but just wanting some feedback.
As for the driveshaft. They average out at $120. $100 local. My steel one needs a good cleaning and coating as well as a new u-joint so wondered if buying an alum would be
better off. I know most say the car feels more peepier and less vibrations at high speeds.
Also are bilstens the way to go for the price? I have no idea on brand the 92 has on right now. Rears are unused Gr2s which I bought on a sale. Just looking for a smooth ride. I know tires can account a lot into this as well which I'm still loooking at as I type this.
As far as my front suspension goes. All looks good. No worn stuff just dirty.
"Depends" -For a big power engine upgrade, you need to look at tranny and suspension - and don't forget brakes. SFC's are a good idea even for a stockish car IMO.
If you're going to get an aftermarket TQ arm, don't do what I did and get a heavier one that still hooks up to the tailshaft....be done with it the 1st time and get one that either hooks up to the crossmember, or get a TQ arm conversion crossmember.
If you're autocrossing, the bilstien's would be nice, but if it's the drag strip 70/30 struts would be better....
Last edited by Confuzed1; 12-24-2010 at 10:33 AM.
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Car: Yes
Engine: Usually
Transmission: Sometimes
Axle/Gears: Behind me somewhere
Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
THE FIRST suspension mod on these cars, should be SFCs.
It is pointless to "mod" a car with a bunch of worn-out OE parts in the way. OE springs, shocks/struts, and bushings, are all CERTAIN to be shot in a car that old. So, the "zero-eth" "mod" should be, RENEW all the used-up stuff; choose springs and shocks/struts consistent with your intended use, replace all the rubber stuff, and go from there.
That said, a replacement torque arm accomplishes 2 things: it takes the front attachment point OFF OF the trans like James talked about, such that the car isn't trying to rip the trans mount in half every time you give it gas, like it does in the stock setup; and it takes a HUGE flexible thing out of the suspension system, thus eliminating something that stores and releases energy unpredictably. However, there are ALOT of other things that cause WORSE misbehavior than the TA does, which if left OE, pretty much prevent the TA from making much, if any, noticeable improvement.
IMO, assuming that the car is in good repair (all new springs & shocks/struts, front CA bushings, ball joints, steering parts, all new sway bar end links & bushings, steering gear tightened up, strut mounts if needed), the order I would THEN do rear suspension mods is:
1. SFCs (welded in)
2. LCARBs, set so the LCA is angled just slightly downward from the frame to the rear, maybe ½" or so;
3. LCAs (ANY are better than stock, which I can flex with my bare hands);
4. TIRES, which should be mounted on wider wheels than any of the skinny stock pizza-cutters that came on these cars, and sized accordingly;
5. TA
It is pointless to "mod" a car with a bunch of worn-out OE parts in the way. OE springs, shocks/struts, and bushings, are all CERTAIN to be shot in a car that old. So, the "zero-eth" "mod" should be, RENEW all the used-up stuff; choose springs and shocks/struts consistent with your intended use, replace all the rubber stuff, and go from there.
That said, a replacement torque arm accomplishes 2 things: it takes the front attachment point OFF OF the trans like James talked about, such that the car isn't trying to rip the trans mount in half every time you give it gas, like it does in the stock setup; and it takes a HUGE flexible thing out of the suspension system, thus eliminating something that stores and releases energy unpredictably. However, there are ALOT of other things that cause WORSE misbehavior than the TA does, which if left OE, pretty much prevent the TA from making much, if any, noticeable improvement.
IMO, assuming that the car is in good repair (all new springs & shocks/struts, front CA bushings, ball joints, steering parts, all new sway bar end links & bushings, steering gear tightened up, strut mounts if needed), the order I would THEN do rear suspension mods is:
1. SFCs (welded in)
2. LCARBs, set so the LCA is angled just slightly downward from the frame to the rear, maybe ½" or so;
3. LCAs (ANY are better than stock, which I can flex with my bare hands);
4. TIRES, which should be mounted on wider wheels than any of the skinny stock pizza-cutters that came on these cars, and sized accordingly;
5. TA
#4
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Car: 89GTA, 62' GSXR1000-SS
Engine: 406-HSR
Transmission: Nocturnal
Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
i would put the Tq arm at the lower end of the list.. with a stock-ish lt1 your not making power to call it a 'need' IMO.. i mean every little thing helps i would replace the worn out suspension peices and go a little soft in the back with some stickier 245+ tires.. the list above sounds about right; after some stout performance parts (drivetrain & suspension) are thrown at it, if not done already
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Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
Is attaching the torque arm to the x-member bad for street driving and potholes? Or does it only affect the feel of accelerating / braking? I have a UMI TQ arm that attaches to the tailshaft, but am wondering if that was a total waste of money and I should have gotten an adjustable x-member mounted one..
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Car: 86 Trans Am, 92 Firebird
Engine: 408 sbc, 3.1L of raw power
Transmission: TKO600, T5
Axle/Gears: Moser 9", 3:70 trutac, 3:23 torsion
Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
Is attaching the torque arm to the x-member bad for street driving and potholes? Or does it only affect the feel of accelerating / braking? I have a UMI TQ arm that attaches to the tailshaft, but am wondering if that was a total waste of money and I should have gotten an adjustable x-member mounted one..
if your not breaking trans mounts or the tail shaft of the trans, the stock style arm will work fine
#7
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Car: 83Z28 HO
Engine: Magnacharged Dart Little M 408
Transmission: G Force 5 speed
Axle/Gears: Moser 9" w/Detroit Trutrac
Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
Is attaching the torque arm to the x-member bad for street driving and potholes? Or does it only affect the feel of accelerating / braking? I have a UMI TQ arm that attaches to the tailshaft, but am wondering if that was a total waste of money and I should have gotten an adjustable x-member mounted one..
At your current level though, you shouldn't have any issues but if you plan on hard launches, you might want to go with the conversion X-member...
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#8
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Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
It makes you wonder why GM didn't make the TQ arm hooked up to the x-member in stock form.. But, yeah, I got the heavier UMI non-adjustable one just like that because I thought it was better because of the poly bushing and stronger steel.
#9
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Car: 83Z28 HO
Engine: Magnacharged Dart Little M 408
Transmission: G Force 5 speed
Axle/Gears: Moser 9" w/Detroit Trutrac
Re: Torque Arm worth the upgrade?
EDIT: Just ordered mine!!
Last edited by Confuzed1; 12-29-2010 at 09:02 AM.
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