ericjon262

After a long hiatus, I'm back. this time, more experienced, with better tools. if there's any guys still on here from the early 2010's or so, you may remember me and some of my stupid ideas, hopefully I've got most of that out of my system.

presenting the energy weapon



well, I guess based on that picture, most of you see that I didn't get the stupid ideas out yet, a smarter person would have bought a better car.

it's an 87 base model, with a 305 and an automatic. the oddball part, it's carbed and not EFI. I thought 86 was the last year for carbs.

in unrelated news, I stumbled upon this aluminum block 5.3 at the junkyard, as well as a a free T5 (I know made of glass)



if you're expecting a fast paced build, I invite you to look at what i've been working on in my 10 year absence from TGO

https://www.realfierotech.com/viewtopic.php?t=17757

yep, a crappy old Fiero, it has a turbo 3.5 V6 that went 12.749 in the quarter at 109 MPH on it's first pass. I'm thinking the Firebird will remain NA, or at least for the time being. if it gets boost, I'll probably go with a procharger.

more to come, very very slowly.

Expenses so far

Car:$1750
aluminum 5.3 with everything:$320
T5 with bellhousing: Free!
Car intake, TB, and Fuel rails: $110
LS2 intake and Fuel rails, no TB $300
Clutch pedal $50
Instrument cluster with gauges $100
trailblazer front diff for possible AWD swap? $75
new repop cat-axle pipe-$36
fuel pump-$48
fuel sending unit-$140
shocks-$62
struts-$28
fuel tank straps-$28
sway bar end links- $10
fuel pressure regulator-$125
Fuel line adapter-$6
Distributor-$50
hatch bolts-$40
gas cap-$10
serpentine belt kit-$200
Total so far: $3488

ericjon262

Thanks!

Hardtop was the number 1 hard fast requirement. I absolutely wouldn't sway from that even if the car came with 10 years of on demand road he.... this is probably still a family forum isn't it...

anywho, I have a ton of things I would like to do, but I have a few projects ahead of this one, a chassis swap, and finishing up a 5 speed swap in a POS Grand Am (The Gran Damn). The Energy Weapon isn't currently a massive priority, but it's one I've wanted to get for a really long time. so I will make it happen, and I can assure you, it will be good.

ericjon262

After careful inspection, the list begins.

Goals:

Sub 3000 pound
50/50 weight distribution (need to get on some scales to find the starting point.)(weight reduction is priority)
Powertrain under a stock appearing hood.
limit body modifications to stock appearing parts.
Fun.

body:

front right fender(glass fenders?)
all weather stripping
"formula" "bulge" hood(glass)
roof dent
Defogger rear glass with CHMSL
headlight parts/lower profile popups.
repair tiny rusts spot on the quarters near decklid
paint.
Panel alignment/hinges
decklid alignment
tint glass
dew wipes
S-10 door handles

Interior:

Carpet
Dash pad (4th gen swap?)
door cards.
seat upholstery
Power windows?
Center console
headliner
cage?
Right side "A" Pillar trim
Steering column

Mechanical & chassis

Tubular K member with LS mounts
adjustable coilovers
Rack and Pinion steering
5 speed pedals
headers
Fuel system
rear disc brakes/axle ratio 4th gen swap? IDK about stickout issues...IRS swap?
SFI bellhousing?
alternate transmission for my T5?
Fuel tank/pump
cage?
MS3 harness
DBWx2
engine bay APP adapter.
Subframe connectors


Some pictures from the inspection process.

the major body damage consists of a dent in the driver's side of the B pillar/roof, and a crumply front right fender.










The battery tray contains more rust than almost the entire rest of the car.





inspection sticker from 1996...




Interior in Meh condition





I think it's a solid foundation, there will be more to follow.

DynoDave43

iTrader: (11)

Cool project. Love the aluminum block...that will help with your weight and balance goals.

ericjon262

yeah, I bought this engine specifically because it was an aluminum block engine. I knew I was going to put it in a Firebird, but I actually bought the engine before the car. I wasn't really shopping for a Firebird, I just saw this one, and determined it was probably going to be the best car for what I wanted to do, and it was IMO, a great price.

in reality, all of the stuff I have right now for the car, just kinda fell into my lap over the past two weeks, I had no intention of getting all of this, I just found out about it and figured it would be good to have for what I eventually want to do. I've also wanted a Firebird for really long time, so the opportunity was there, I struck.

My ultra long term goals for the car include an engine that's way different than anything else I've seen in a third gen, but parts are hard to get, so until I have a few more critical points I won't really mention more than that, it would definitely make way more power than a LS.

ericjon262

I popped the valve covers off the 5.3, they were pretty clean for a junkyard engine.







I was also able to snag a car intake, it's an LS4 intake, which isn't the best performance part, but it was a very inexpensive option for a car intake. I might try and open up the restriction in the neck, and make a few other modifications obviously in this picture it's backwards, I just tossed it on there to cover the intake ports, which were also pretty clean for a junkyard engine.

ericjon262

No pictures, but I recently picked up an LS2 intake, and a clutch pedal assembly from a 4th gen. This car isn't really a priority at the moment, so progress is going to continue to amount to the occasional new part for it.

I'm currently seriously debating transmission related issues. I have the T5, it was free, it has a bellhousing, but no flywheel/clutch. and was pulled out of a field, so it may already be junk. My initial plan, was to throw the T5 in, and drive it to failure, then swap in a TKX or other aftermarket variant that's stronger, but not knowing the current transmission's internal condition, I'm considering just ponying up the cash for a T56, it's a stronger, more reliable transmission out of the box, and if I have to turn around an swap in a TKO/TKX for the T5, I'm well into T56 costs additionally, the T5 was never mated to a LS, so I'll need to make sure I get the right clutch/flywheel, whereas the T56 came behind the LSx in stock form, so I can just use LS parts off the shelf with no fuss.

Thoughts?

Kingtal0n

If you are going over 500rwhp the 4l80e is a low cost solution compared to the proper 6-speed swap. Its also more well suited for 500+ to the tires in terms of drag racing.

But you strike me as a manual transmission person. In which case- The transmission is the most important part of the swap. Use the best 6-speed you can get your hands on. Use a proper twin disc or floating single unit style clutch.
Put the money into the clutch and trans.

ericjon262

Definitely wanting the car to be a manual, if I were going auto, it would either be an 80e, or a built 200-4R, definitely no 700R4's or 4L60/65/70e's in my future.

I've done a little more research, the T56 is about 40 pounds heavier than the T5 based aftermarket transmissions, the only real benefit is that you get a little bit longer legs on the hwy.

From my research,
T56 Pros:

up to a 0.5:1 overdrive
strong even in stock form

T56 cons:
40 lbs heavier
unless a smoking deal is found, more expensive, a typical stock used T56 costs as much or more than a new TKX.
bulkier than a T5 based transmission

T5/TKX pros

I have one that I didn't pay a dime for, even if it's junk I can use it as a mockup piece, and drive the car with if it's not already junk.
40 pounds lighter
physically smaller than a T56 which leaves more room for undercar activities...
stock console has the right shift pattern.

T5/TKX cons
I have to buy a stronger transmission to have something reliable.
more performance oriented gear rations will hurt hwy mileage (.81:1 final Vs .68:1)


Because weight plays a significant factor in my desires for this build, and I will need as much real estate available under the car as possible for some of my plans, I'm leaning towards the TKX, 6 speed is cooler, and more modern, but it's hard to take 40 pounds out of a car elsewhere, and while I intend to drive this car alot, I don't at this moment, see a .81 final as being a dealbreaker yet, hell, both of my DD's get 11 MPG anyway, so this is bound to be ridiculously better.

Kingtal0n

IMO The point of the six speed is the deep 0.5:1 overdrive. It allows you to achieve up to 30mpg with a 1000rwhp engine swap at 3000lbs vehicle using any rear gear you want. Looking backwards through the rear gear the six speed will make far more sense. I am not sure why you obsess about 50lbs or 100lbs. The engine is aluminum that is -120lbs right there you already doubled your weight savings with change to spare. Weight has two major influence, one is power:weight ratio which afflicts handling and acceleration/braking. The other is economy which is offset sharply by the overdrive ratio of the 6-speed which leaves strictly accel/decel handling capability. The weight is central to the vehicle which actually has a stabilizing influence at higher speeds its nice to have some belly weight when the vehicle has some performance capability. The engine (I assume its a 02-07 L33 or LM4) is capable of easily 800rwhp using a proper forced induction setup and the difference in performance regarding 50 or even 150lbs is negligible given the engines capability.

If I didn't have 4l80e I would use a brand new six speed with a twin disc. Yes it will cost more than the entire car. But the end result is decades of 30mpg and 800 to the tires because I would never use an LS engine without a turbocharger.

ericjon262

I'm not currently planning for a turbocharger on this car, if it gets forced induction, it will probably be via a procharger instead of a turbo. Don't get me wrong, turbos are great, my other car (in the sig) is a turbo V6 and is all sorts of fun, but I want something a bit different out of this car. it's also worth mentioning that the weight is not the only thing leaning me towards the T5 based transmission, the T56 is also bulkier than the T5 based transmission, some of the ideas I would like to implement for the exhaust under the car, may require a little more room to execute cleanly.

as far as weight placement, if the car is going to have an extra 40 pounds, you're right, the trans is almost the ideal place to have it, central and LOW, but I will say, that no weight is good weight for short distance acceleration, if traction is a problem, better tires are needed! I want to build this car to ride like it's on rails, and there are places weight can be taken out, that i'd rather not sacrifice, like AC. again, if I was planning forced induction, weight would quickly become a non issue.

as for which 5.3 I have, I'm really not sure, I know it's all aluminum, and it came out of an Isuzu Ascender. that's about all I know, and it's really not super important, it's not going to stay stock, and if I can find a deal on an aluminum 6.0/6.2 block, it won't stay at all.

ericjon262

The biggest issue on the body of the car, is this dent, that's right at the top of the B pillar, where it transitions over the roof, it had been driving me crazy since I bought the car, because it was otherwise very straight. my first thought, was to pull the headliner, and try and push the dent out from inside, unfortunately, the seatbelt brackets block the dent, along with some of the internal roof structure, so I used it as an excuse to pick up a new tool, a stud gun from horrible freight.









The primer really hides the issues with the bodywork, it's far from perfect, but the stud gun allowed me to get the B piller straight, and most of the roof to within a range that's reasonable for body filler. as far as body work goes, I'm not real set on making this car perfect, or even a 20 ft car at the moment. I'll put some paint on the roof where I've worked on it, and call it good for the time being.


I installed a new fuel tank, it came with the car. so it made sense to use it instead of trying to swap to a 4th gen tank, I however, did not have a sending unit. being that I want to eventually make the car EFI, I elected to put a sender in that has provisions for a fuel pump. little did I know the stock LG4 has both a block mounted mechanical pump, and an electric pump. the electric pump in my old tank was shot, so I put a regular EFI pump in , and am going to install a block off plate and fuel pressure regulator in place of the mechanical pump.

I made the block off plate, and enlarged the holes in the Holley FPR bracket so that it could use two of the block off plate bolt holes, and mount right where the pump was.

in the mill



block off plate



FPR with enlarged bracket holes



FPR on the block off plate



I'll try and get it all installed on Monday when I get off work. The flare fittings are basically AN fittings, I'm only using them because they were free, otherwise, i would probably just hose clamp the them with barb fittings.

I've been vaguely looking into rear end options, I thought a 4th get rear was an inch wider per side, which would be acceptable with stock sized wheels, unfortunately, at 1.5-2 inches wider per side, that's a bit too much, I have a few ideas floating around, but I haven't made a firm decision on one yet.

ericjon262

unfortunately, the fuel pressure regulator didn't quite bolt on the way I hoped, so I will make a small bracket to hole it about 1" further forward. Right now I have it held on with just one bolt, I took the car for a short drive around the block, and everything went well, except for the fact that the car desperately needs a muffler installed.

ericjon262

anyone have thoughts on the Hawk's headliner board? is it any good? I'm going to do some reading in the interior board and see if I can find anything, my existing board is salvageable, but if a new one is pretty nice, I may spring for it.

in other news, I got the adapter bracket made for the fuel pressure regulator, I'm happy with the results, for now it makes everything nice and neat.

ericjon262

Water pump is off, I have a serpentine belt drive kit for a smallblock, so I figured there's no time like the present to put it on, it will require me to adjust the harness a little bit, but I'm ok with that, I need to make a couple of wiring repairs anyways.

Because the previous owner removed the AIR pump and cat, and I don't have parts to go back on to replace them, I went ahead and removed the tubes for the AIR system, to clean things up a bit



with the water pump off, I decided to flush the block out a bit... ew.



My 88 Suburban's(The Pig Rig) 350 was similar when I rinsed it, so I'm not overly worried about it, what I would like to do, is fill it with water, run it, and dump it a few times and try and get some of the corrosion products out before I throw some 50/50 in and call it good. if the block drains were easier to get to, I would try and flood water in through them, but they're kinda a PITA, so I'm not going to. Depending on how things go, I'm considering taking the TBI setup off the pig and putting it on this car, but I need to button up an L31 for it before I can do that. it would be nice to have EFI and not the weird computer controlled carb.