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So since this car has more significance to me than most others, I feel like for the first time in half a decade I'd do a build thread for it like the good old days before forums fell hard to social media. Really glad to see TGO still is one of the few holding good activity/community vs so many of the other platforms. I've been dead set on getting into a third gen again for years to do my ideal street setup in
I've known about the car for about 5 years. I have a friend who lives about 40 minutes away I used to swap DSM parts with now. He's a very gifted fabricator and his dad is as well. His dad had a full gutted/built cutlass he traded for this car as he wanted a street car. I was in love with it from the first time I saw it. I sold my mustang and wasn't sure what to replace it with but was thinking a third gen or new edge mustang shell to finally do an LS swap in. My buddy just happened to mention that his dad mentioned selling this. So next think I know - I bought it pretty much instantly. I paid pretty much what I expected to have in just buying a shell & motor so I couldn't be happier.
About the car - It's originally a 1984 4 cylinder car. I'm not as in touch with all the different years as most but if my memory serves it has the updated tail lights, front end, and of course the fake iroc/z28 badging. Not sure of miles on the chassis as it has all autometer gauges
My friend's dad traded for it already swapped but he cleaned up and fixed a lot of misc stuff. Had a 4l60e originally that **** the bed and he threw in a Th350 he had just to have it on the road. Build isn't too crazy, Rebuilt LS1 with aftermarket pistons my buddy's dad couldn't remember. It does have arp studs, 243's, fast 92 intake, 60lb injectors, Comp Cam unknown (he's supposed to find the cam card for me). Stock GM ecu, th350, B&M ratchet shifter, some random converter that flashes to like 4500rpm. Still a 10 bolt and it whines a little bit. Has all tubular control arms, k member, etc. Wilwood front brakes Autometer speedo/volt/fuel/tach/oil pressure in factory locations minus the a-pillar fuel gauge. Also has a wideband that is just loose on the floor right now lol. Weighs in at 2850 currently.
My current plans: Ended up going with QP 9" and blower didn't happen yet but stll in the plans I have a line on a 31 spline explorer 8.8" rear to replace the dying 10 bolt. My buddy is excited to help with the fab work for this car since he always wanted his dad to do more with it. I'm going to be taking him the 10 bolt and having him swap the axle tubes to the 8.8" and basically keep a lot of the factory mounting location spots for overall ease of install as I'm not as mechanically inclined as most so I'm trying to keep it easy but also realistic as I could go drop $2500-3k on a complete 9" but it just isn't necessary for what I want.
I'm still transmission shopping but looking for a T56 magnum or a built/fresh regular T56. Worst case I have a line on a core and do a stock/mild rebuild which a place locally has done for around $800-1200 in the past.
Budget & time permitting I also would like to go to a blower this winter as well but I'm prioritizing the Trans & rear swaps first as I'm fine with enjoying the H/C/I setup for next year instead of having the car down because of a blower build.
While I begin searching and buying parts though I'm still enjoying the car as it is - it's still very fun to drive especially as I pretend I don't hear the popping and droning from the 10 bolt. I'll be trailering it to the track Sunday and I hope to break into the 11's. Honestly with past experience with my cam only and H/C 4th gen's - I'm hoping this one can see mid 11's but the tune isn't perfect. It's a very "safe" rich tune.
I picked it up Sunday and it was pretty filthy from sitting in the back of my buddy's warehouse at his fab shop. So naturally first thing I did was cleaned it up and took some pictures.
I actually sold my built C6 to a friend - here's a picture of the two cars together
Little about me/my car history now:
To preface while I'm not new to the game, It has been a decade since I've been in a third gen and back then I had no idea what I was doing with my bolt on 350 TPI Formula. I'm really not brand biased at all and have owned a bunch of different cars. My bread and butter was always DSM's and I still have my original one I bought in 2009 that replaced my 91 Firebird. I've had 10 or so DSM's, a few 4th gen fbodies 2 of which I did heads/cam/intake setups on, lot of bikes, an LS2 c6 vette I fully built (TMS forged 6.0, Vortech T-trim blower, etc), and I just sold my 20k mile blown 14 GT because I just couldn't find motivation to modify it further.
Have been a few other fbodies/mustangs/vette in there not worth mentioning as well but in the end pretty much since I sold my old 91 bird my friends have known me for constantly talking about wanting to find a good third gen again to do my ideal LS street build in. I got close a few times but something always came up or the car wasn't what I expected as I've been very picky.
I tap out on the 600-700whp area as I feel like that's the sweet spot for me in a street car. Most of my friends are now seeing the 700-1000whp range and doing more serious racing. My end goal would be to hit 9.9's which was my goal in the vette but I didn't want to end up replacing my stock diff, axles, or trans lol. Above all else though I just want to be able to go on a couple hour road trip without much worry and be able to rip some gears.
Here's a random throwback to 2009 - my first car, the 92 teal non turbo laser, my 91 formula, and my 92 Talon TSi AWD I bought back in 2017 and still have today.
Last edited by DomesticCheese; 05-02-2022 at 12:07 PM.
Nice car! Someone put a lot of time and money in it at some point.
Thank you! No doubt, I forgot to mention it even has wilwood front brakes - so they definitely didn't spare some costs. But I've also found a few things where I really wish they had spared a bit more cost or time lol.
Nice. I'm jealous.
Thanks brother!
Couple updates - made it to the track and into the 11's yesterday as it sits - I also made the first plunges and bought a BNIB hawks t56 crossmember off FB market place for a great deal and also a ~500 mile practically new looking Monster LT1 Twin Disc full clutch kit including its flywheel and all for $700.
I've had poor luck finding a decent deal on a trans so I think this week I might take the big plunge and just buy a fresh T56 Magnum straight from Tick Performance. I did source my 8.8" just need to go pick it up and then wait until I put the car into the garage for the last time in November to pull the 10bolt and take both to my buddy to fab it up for the car.
Also purchased a generic black aluminum coolant overflow that is about 1/4 the size of the stock one and should look way better. Also picking up a 4th gen brake booster to clean up some room by the third gen's huge can of one.
Yesterday was the last big track day at our local 1/4 mile track so a few people from here took their cars. The night before though I wanted to change the oil before going just because I wasn't sure when it had been done last. I found the following on the drain plug, full of needle bearings!
Initially called it quits on going to the track. Turns out my buddy's dad just had one fail and did a trunion upgrade and just didn't change the oil. I pulled VC's and everything was great.
Then decided to throw in my new kenwood x304 headunit I splurged on and was hoping to find the issue with my tail lights/dash lights in the process. Sure enough a few wires just loose in there - a gray one was the culprit. However I found the wiring situation an absolute mess behind it and also under the dash on the drivers side. Bad enough to the point that I'll probably be rewiring the entire car. Going to plan to keep it as is for now to focus on the 6speed/rear/FI build. Then next winter focus on wiring and probably switching to a Holly Terminator and get away from the stock ECU. That said though I currently have tail lights/sidemarkers/dash lights that I never had before.
Then loaded up and hit the track! I made 3 passes. could of made a few more but I really would like to keep driving the car for a few more weeks so didn't want to abuse the very noisy 10 bolt anymore lol
I ran 11.8@114 11.7@115 and 11.8@115. Both 11.8's it spun a bit on the launch and the 11.7 I must not of hit the shifter right and it bounced the limiter a few times before I hit it again into third. The DA was also crap @ 3200 so I would like to think this thing could even of clicked an 11.4-11.5 though it doesn't have a ton of mph.
Either way for a fairly rich tuned essentially cam only LS1 I was pretty happy with it. Glad I got to get at least get a time out of it with the auto/10bolt before I yank it all.
Few pictures from the day:
My buddy who had never used a DSLR was working my camera so didn't get the best positioning down first time but still got some decent pictures.
***** and giggles my buddy's car I went with who were break into the 7's - he originally had a matching C6 to mine except he had about 900-1000whp to my 600whp haha. The foxbody was coyote swapped with an intake and 5 speed and ran 10.5's then my two friends decided to combine the cars to try to competitively race stick shift classes. They've won a bunch of stick shift stuff at Anarchy/SCT and a couple other big events and got few solid sponsorships including from procharger and had a few best of 8.2's - yesterday they were fighting wheelies and then they got a perfect run and it lost power at the top end. Then it didn't want to stay running and we definitely think it's hurt - but regardless it had a great year with a lot of money/events won.
That was the weekend though, was good to get the car out and have some fun with it. I'm getting eager to start pulling everything apart for the 6 speed!
Great looking Camaro, you're from around the Des Moines area? I also had a C6, sold it when I bought my house, bought the GTA shortly after. I liked the old C6, I still miss it time to time.
Nice car. You'd never know it had a 4-banger. You're a more courageous man than me with an LS and big tires using a stock 10-bolt. I'd be afraid of major carnage resulting in the axle walking out of the housing and the tire destroying the quarter panel.
Great looking Camaro, you're from around the Des Moines area? I also had a C6, sold it when I bought my house, bought the GTA shortly after. I liked the old C6, I still miss it time to time.
I'm from SE Iowa, Burlington to be specific right on the Illinois border and about 40 mins from missouri.
I loved my C6 and would really like to get another one at some point ideally just a cam only targa car for cruising as this car gets a bit more serious. I'll always drive the hell out of this thing but I'd love to have a C6 alongside it.
Originally Posted by GarageToys
Nice car. You'd never know it had a 4-banger. You're a more courageous man than me with an LS and big tires using a stock 10-bolt. I'd be afraid of major carnage resulting in the axle walking out of the housing and the tire destroying the quarter panel.
Looking forward to updates.
Absolutely - I couldn't believe it when they told me it was an 84 let alone a 4cylinder car. I'm pretty thankful though for the lighter car it gives me as well as stuff like the factory AC-less system so I don't have to hunt forever for a heater box or run the factory unit with the accumulator hanging there taking up a ton of space. Honestly I fully expected to destroy the rear at the track that day - it makes so much noise right now howling and slow speed grinds/pops so I wasn't sure if I'd even make it the one pass. Still going though haha at this point I'm just happy I've gotten to enjoy the car as is a bit after buying it before it goes under the knife and stored for the winter. Plus we're getting a lot of nice days right now.
Still nothing real new on the car, no pictures but I did swap in a small black sheet metal overflow to get rid of the giant stock one and got my clutch and crossmember in. I also put in all new speakers which changed the audio entirely, it sounds so good now I don't even care to put my 8" amp/sub combo in out of my truck to keep it clean of wires. At this point I'm just waiting until Black Friday to hopefully find a deal that might save me a $100-200+ off a brand new t56 magnum.
Well I should probably update here. Not much new. I got the COVID and a close family member got it and passed away from it so I pretty much haven't been able to give any attention to the project which is mostly still ordering parts right now.
I did however right before chaos hit here get my order out for my new T56 magnum from Tick Performance and for my complete bolt-in setup 9" from Quick Performance. Got the magnum here before Christmas - still waiting on the 9". Still need to get the other odds and ends ordered though like master cylinder, pedals, a shifter, and anything else along the way.
We still have yet to really have snow here or anything despite people an hour north getting dumped on so I've still found occasion to drive the car a couple times a week too.
been a long time but finally worth updating.
Life stayed super busy and I didn't touch the car with the upgrades.
I still drove it a lot up until a couple weeks ago though with the TH350/10bolt but the 10bolt was getting noisier and noisier and frankly I'm tired of 4.10's and TH350 and I've had more free time.
I took it to a buddy's shop with A/C for his help and it was in the middle of the 90-100 heatwave a couple weeks ago.
I've been founding a few things I forgot that I've been scrambling for but we're about there. The main hangup right now is my rear brakes for the 9". We found some issues with the rear brake setup I had with the 10bolt and it would be more of an annoyance using them and running a parking brake which I hate going without on manual cars. I'm checking some things tonight but the plan tomorrow is to order Quick Performance's full disc brake kit for the 9".
So currently rear end is in - still need to have bearing pressed on axles which will be done this week. Going to move to interior to cut shifter hole and will hopefully be able to raise the magnum into her new home for the first time. Fingers crossed!
I'm not really in a huge rush but I'm hoping to have it on the road in a couple weeks.
Like most projects a couple weeks turned into months lol. Lots small things and waiting on parts and researching stuff held things up.
One dumb thing I overlooked is that although I've played with fbodies I've never had more than a cam only stock suspension fourth gen or a bolt on 350 TPI third gen. The only cars I've done front to back work to and gotten familiar to a more full extent are my DSM's and my C6 vette. With this I overlooked that my rear discs were not LS1 brakes. Previous owner thought they were as well so I just went with it. During winter my buddy whose shop I had it at to enlist his help and his lift needed his space frequently for other cars. So a good number of my visits for a month were trying to figure out how to get my brakes to work and we modified them a bit to fit them but it still wasn't right. Finally it hit me when I looked a fourth gen diagram how different the backing plates were and I had ordered the rear with fbody ends for LS1 brakes. So with that I found an LS1 rear disc complete conversion set and bought it and everything went together smooth.
My other issues were wiring woes which this car has a lot of and some issues with my rear suspension. Everything fits and works now but it has made me certain I'm going to be upgrading from my non adjustable LCA's and panhard bar in the next month or so. Then other holdups involved some ujoint/yoke issues that I THOUGHT we had but ended up we were just not being mean enough to it and ended up fitting.
One big issue that I had last year is one of the wheel studs backed out of the wilwood hub on the front. Then after removing the wheels to test fit some new ones once, I noticed one had broke and another backed out I tried to get it in again but it had ruined the threads already. So I had one side with a backed out stud. Another with one stud broke and one backed out. So that was when we only took it to a couple cruise nights locally and then I started the work in August whenever I was able to have time at my buddy's shop. I opted to forgo a lot of other stuff until I could bring the car home such as the parking brake (need to fabricate bracket), trans wiring, clutch safety wiring, etc just because it had took too long to get where i was and my buddy was getting busier and busier and I just wanted to have the car home. So in December we finally got her on the ground moving under her own power again. I managed to drive it in single digit freezing temps about 2 miles across town to my house where it sat for January/February/March until it was warm enough I cared to mess with it
I ordered a new wilwood hub and new wheel studs as well as bearings and replaced everything on the driverside front. The passenger side I'm now waiting for my new stud since only one has backed out and the threads arent too bad I'm going to hopefully save the hub and remove and reinstall the other studs as well with red loctight and hopefully be in the clear. Otherwise last week I also fixed an issue with my brake light switch wiring which had been keeping me from driving it because they were stuck on. I fixed some mess around the ECU and made it a new hanger under the glovebox since it has been laying on the floor since it fell out last July from the old crappy rig.
I also install some 3" turn down tips as unfortunately my exhaust no longer fit as the header points directly at the new crossmember. So she's temporarily extremely loud until I can get it in with my buddy to have him fabricate some fancyness and I plan to reuse at least the over-axle part of my old exhaust as it was a good true dual setup and rather than the single muffler with single dual exit point I plan to do a more typical out the back exhaust probably with borla bullets or something after I get the car to him.
I began driving it a bunch last week and even drove it for work one day which is 30 miles each way and it did great on the highway. Even did a mpg test since that matters in today's world lol and she managed 27mpg.
Yesterday I heard a clunk and one of my brake backing plate bolts backed out and another was loose so I have it in the air - tonight when I'm off work I'm installing new bolts with loctite and checking the other side.
That said though things are finally shaping up for it and its driveable. I plan to tackle the wiring disaster and find the wires to set up a clutch safety switch and my reverse lockout. Then my speedometer. While it's getting exhaust work by my fabricator buddy (whose dad I got the car from) I'm going to have him fab the bracket for the ebrake as well as install some quality of life strap mounts on the new rear.
I also haven't been able to fit my street wheels on the front because of the wilwood brake hub so I believe I'll be ordering a set of polished race star fronts 17x7 to put street tires on for a street setup - for now she's mismatched. I also removed all the fake IROC decals/pinstriping.
Having the car at home and my schedule freeing up a lot has been giving me a lot more time to give it attention.
here are some pictures from the last few months
Old very noisy and tired 10bolt
New magnum & 9" looking pretty
Rear is in/mocked up
Trans is in
Underside:
Interior work:
Last edited by DomesticCheese; 05-02-2022 at 11:39 AM.
Exhaust fabrication to include bracket to cleanly install my parking brake
Review tune but should still be solid
New wheels/tires for the street - also might roll fenders in the rear since my slicks hit them in bumps occasionally
I plan to just enjoy the car this summer as it is - what should be a bullet proof H/C/I LS / T56 Magnum / 9" street car.
It's very hard to ignore however how much of a wiring nightmare/shitshow the car is. At one point the car had a Holley Dominator when first swapped many years ago. Car was almost never driven and then traded and part of the deal was they kept the dominator. The chassis harness had already been in poor shape but from what I can see they just wanted the Holley out quick and the stock PCM in quick. The engine bay wiring isn't perfect but it's decent enough. Once you get to the stuff you don't see though it's awful. Everything works but I don't even feel safe wiring my tiny 10" amplified sub all-in-one lower power unit into the current harness. One thing I've purchased a from a friend is a Holley Terminator X setup. I'm also buying a full rewire kit to rewire the chassis. It shouldn't be too bad beings that the car is a bare option car with almost no power options to worry about. That said I HATE wiring and have never done a full resto around it but being into DSM"s I've had to rewire plenty of hackjobs and brittle/broken wires so I'm sure if I hunker down and take my time I can make it work without reinventing the wheel and I can keep it clean.
That will my big plan for this next winter and if possible look towards the blower. It's easier to talk about it than it will be to be ready at the time though and I may just choose to fully focus on leaving all alone until I get all new wiring done.
Last edited by DomesticCheese; 05-02-2022 at 11:51 AM.
So apparently my backing plate bolts weren't tight enough, lost two fully yikes. Could heard the sound of the caliper moving somehow despite how loud the damn car is right now. I ordered from amazon a brand new set of T bolts and got my package Wednesday, the amazon white padded envelope was totally open like it had never been sealed. No parts, now amazon is "forcing" me to exchange my defective parts for my new one so I'm literally sending them the empty package back lol so whatever. My replacement bolts should be here today but we have some plans with my gf's parents so tomorrow I'll hopefully have it back on the road. Happened on passenger side but I'm replacing the ones on the driver side as well and loctiting them. My buddy bolted them up after he took the axles to his work to have the bearing pressed on the axle so i just want to be sure the other side is good too, I ain't upset since i caught it at least lol, plus I didnt realize they were just hardware store bolts someone had used before I owned the car so I'd rather replace them all anyway with proper T bolts.
I also wasn't sure what people use for shift boot retainers in third gens. I found one for fourth gens that is an actual console mounted square piece with clip points but the only one I saw for third gen is like $23-30 for just a ring. So I just stole some welding wire out of my amazon flux welder, it works lol.
One thing I did buy my Holley Terminator X today! For the future but can't wait to convert it over and redo all wiring.
Random pic of my shift boot since nothing else interesting lol. Also got my little locknut to align the **** and I have coming an interior hardware kit from hawks as well as their 6 speed diagram to go over the 5 speed. It's the little things
Get yourself a claw foot to get into that tight space behind the brakes and use a proper torque wrench to tighten those T-bolts. You'll have to use a corrected torque with the extra length of the claw foot, https://www.engineersedge.com/manufa...e_wrench_1.htm
Use blue Loctite and apply a lot of it onto the bolt. I've seen engineering studies of breakaway torque with Loctite and I can tell you it doesn't do jack squat unless you apply it like a sloppy mess. You can use red but you might not ever get it apart again without a torch.
Get yourself a claw foot to get into that tight space behind the brakes and use a proper torque wrench to tighten those T-bolts. You'll have to use a corrected torque with the extra length of the claw foot, https://www.engineersedge.com/manufa...e_wrench_1.htm
Use blue Loctite and apply a lot of it onto the bolt. I've seen engineering studies of breakaway torque with Loctite and I can tell you it doesn't do jack squat unless you apply it like a sloppy mess. You can use red but you might not ever get it apart again without a torch.
Ty for this! I didnt post when I read it yesterday but was about to make it more complicated for myself until I read here, totally forgot claw/crow wrenches were a thing and bought a cheap set for $12 from Harbor Freight that worked perfectly. Got her all back together and gf and I went on a little cruise. I gave it the first WOT in 1st gear I've done and it just spun. Cruised a bit more then on the trip back home was hearing some popping noises and some scraping noise when rolling slow - as hard as it is to hear over the exhaust right now. I jacked it up took the wheels off and looked around but can't find anything wrong.
Almost sounded more from rear or driveshaft area, was late and tired though so left it be for now. Super busy week between the 2 days ill be at work and being out of town for 2 different concerts driving all over the midwest. So unfortunately I might not have time to mess with it until next week since we'll be coming home Sunday evening.
10-07-2020, 09:35 AM
