alex722607

iTrader: (3)

stock 4th gen pump.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Radiator is in!
My TPI has an Engine oil cooler, for now I am thinking of using a fitting and routing it to the left lower outlet. Also, for now I am plugging the steam line. I will get a pic of it tomorrow and Scooter I did not forget about you, I will get some pics of the hatch mounting.

Today I had to gut my interior and dry the floor pans and recoat them with paint to prevent rust. I have been meaniong to do it for a long time and today turned into the day to do it. (I blame myself for the water because I purchased seals from two different sources 2 years ago and they don't quite fit right) I have yet to splurge on a kit from 1A Auto... I keep looking for LS stuff )

Any way the interior is back together for the most part except for the door sills. The radiator is sitting in its new home with most everything connected. The upper hose fit perfect because its new and tight. When I trimmed it I used the piece to make my lower hose fit snug and used two clamps for good measure. For now the coolant level sensor hole is plugged with what it came with from Rockauto. The tranny cooler lines fit perfectly. The one thing I still have to do is route the engine oil cooler line to the left side of the radiator.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

You need a steam line, the engine is difficult to bleed and you risk overheating it. Its simple esp with your LT1 radiator. The port under the overflow goes strait to the steamline on the engine. No "make it work", just hook A to B

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

My bad, I didn't specify, lol. Yes when I go LS I will use the steam line , but for now I can't use it with my tpi.

On a side note, I have been compiling diagrams for my swap, but one thing I am not sure of: what does the bottom left spout on the radiator route to on the LS motor. For my gen 1 sbc, I am going to use it for the engine oil cooler, but have no idea what the LS does with it.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

I see, thought all this was being compiled for a swap, not fix it for now

Yes, plug it for now. Your heater core will be a trick without a return port

Not sure what the BL port is for. LS1 radiators have them too, but capped from the factory. PS cooler? Oil cooler? W/e, you likely dont need it, so cap it

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Okay so for anyone that wants to use an lt/ls radiator with tuned port injection here is what I did:

Top left stock hose works fine
Top right reservoir works aswell
Steam can be capped with the same size hose as the reservoir
Tranny cooler lines works like a charm
Lower hose will not work because the radiator has a smaller outlet. I used a new 88 lower hose and put a piece of the top stock hose in there for now. It holds pressure and as longasitstight and snug it shouldn't blow off, but my search for a good perfectly fitting one continues.

The engine oil cooler works if you by an 02 t/a heater hose, I trimmed it and ran it to the lower left port on the radiator. I had a kink so I used part of the old hose and ran it to a fitting and then attached the heater hose to it. Squeezes perfectly between the power steering lines.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

I come bearing updates:

Everything fits fine in terms of the radiator. The stock fan and shroud is a bit tight and the left fan on my dual fan set up has to be unplugged. I am getting an LS shroud and fans so that will take care of that.

One fan in traffic just aint cuttin it, especially the crappy fans TPI's got from the factory in 88.
I am not thrilled, but hey for two months, I can deal with it. (as long as it doesn't leak) and further down the line I won't have trouble with the LS1 water pump and hoses.



So I drove it to school and back, no problems besides a weird burning smell, but I am told that it is normal for a new radiator and it is not constant.

On a side note I got a bunch of parts today: an alternator with bracket (used, but I am getting a new alternator), pw steering pump and bracket and lines, balancer, pan, windage tray and pickup and I also got a dipstick, 4l60e shift lever cable, and ARP head bolts and misc stuff.

On another side note, my proportioning valve started leaking today so I got a new one AC delco 172-2005. (I have all wheel disc brakes) So my car is out of action for a couple days.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Haven't updated in a while, so here it goes

Been busy, but I have

1). realized that I got 04-06 ARP head bolts, so those are for sale and I bought 99-03 bolts
2). got a cam and water pump the later was new and the ls1 cam was used. I used cam lube and swapped out the old for the new. Then I reralized I purchased the timing chain from JEGS only it was for a 6.0 and not a 5.3 and the oil pump was hitting the chain. So I am exchanging it. I didnt think there would be a difference, but after speaking with them on the phone I figured what the hell, why not
3). got new lifters (LS7)
4). now I started working on assembling fuel system stuff. For now I am going to reuse the plastic lines from the new tank for now. I drew up a rough diagram with the fittings I think I will need. Thoughts??

Parts are as follows:
640940
610020(2)
74730
610160 (3)
FCM2255
981506
21606
640850

and braided ss line of course



if it doesn't come up here is the link:

http://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/...ps7149a360.jpg

please note where it says plastic line and the rectangular object and the number 74730 after that is the feed and the ls1-f fuel filter and the fitting for it to turn to an (or so I am led to believe)

Please let me know if I am on the right track

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

this is a cleaned up version of it. Input please!

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

All LSx timing sets for wetsump engines interchange. The cam sprocket is different and VVT engines use a single large bolt to retain the sprocket where older engines use 3 bolts. Post a pic of the interference, might be something simple

FWIW, I use a LS2 timing set (6.0) for all my rebuilds, 5.3, 5.7, 6.0 etc

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

the chain was hitting my M265 oil pump: it was rubbing. Note the nick on the pickup inlet

The timing set is already on its way back to Jegs so I can't post a pic of that.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

so about the fuel system i drew up, what are your thoughts? Is it me or will the T make the return pressurized as well. Is the regulator on the LS1 fuel tank pump on the return to stop this from happening? I am so confused to the point I am thinking of getting a vette filter.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Thats a standard pump, so you def had issues. Dbl roller chain perhaps?

Didnt check the PDF, but your basic sketch looks fine as long as you have a V8 plastic tank. The pump pressurizes the whole system and the regulator bleeds off excess pressure

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

yea its a double roller. Could that be it? I mean could I get a single roller from Jegs, because all I found was a double.


I have a v8 tank, so basically the entire thing is pressurized and the regulator bleeds the return ? So both feed and return are under the same pressure?

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Here:
http://www.rockauto.com/

Punch in a 03 avalanche and pick timing set. Pick your favorite brand and go. Upper sprocket type doesnt matter, your cam sensor is rear mounted so theres nothing to read any type of reluctor cast into the sprocket. The reluctor will clear the timing cover, so it doesnt matter if its present or not

Dbl rollers require clearancing the pump and timing set. IMHO, they are totally unnecessary in LSx with stock chains being plenty strong

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Ok I got that from Rockauto just now, I got the cloyes brand name along with a couple sensors I need for this thing.

Tomorrow I'll call jegs and just tell them to refund me for the timing set i sent back today.

Thx Pocket.


At some point if you could look over the fuel diagram, that would be great. Thanks so much.

Also I am thinking of getting my tranny from these people:

http://transmission-kings.com/BUY_ME_NOW.html

They quoted me 900 for it delivered to my door (completely rebuilt 4L60e with a new HD converter and 2yr warranty.)

Any experiences, thoughts??

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Update:
I got the right side engine head on the engine and i am in the process of putting on the front cover. After that will come the other head, the balancer, and then on the engine hoist it goes. Basically I have an engine that has everything new from the lifters up and forward.
I got a new gm flexplate cheap and am ordering the transmission sometime this week. I have all my fuel system components. Now I will need an exhaust system and a tune and I am done with spending money for it. Lol😀

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

I think I am going to pull the engine on Saturday

Thoughts?

I just found a couple pics and update the beginning of this thread with them. When I look at the progression of this car in history, I want to cry sometimes. The things it went through are incredible and heart breaking at the same time.

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Are you planning on pulling the engine out the top or out the bottom?

I highly recommend that you talk to some people before you buy a transmission. I put a Monster trany in mine and it works great.

I just went out and bought a trany from a transmission shop on my first project car. It was a total piece of crap. After talking to some people and getting referred to a few good companies I ended up having to buy a second trany before I got it right. It was such a waste of money. Not all transmission shops are created equal! Just food for thought.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Thanks Dave!

I am going to be pulling the engine and trans out from the top. I don't have the means of getting it up that high to drop the power train out of the car. It also looks like I will be putting the ls in from the top. Depending on how it goes I don't know if I will be able to do so with it bolted to the tranny or not. I have a crossmember that was notched for a/c and more importantly the oil pan so it might clear.

I started looking at that tranny place because they sell rebuilds with a converter and fluid with a 2 year warranty or a very good price. They also have monster tranny's for roughly the same price, which I think I will go with.

Here is the link:

http://transmission-kings.com/BUY_ME_NOW.html


My dad also suggested IVAN Transmissions which is close by. I intend to call them and ask what they can do for me.

Right now Transmission Kings seems like the way to go, but who knows.



EDIT: The day has come, I will be starting to pull the Chevrolet Small block 350 and Turbo-Hydromatic 700R4 tomorrow.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Oh by the way how is your red GTA coming Dave?

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Just take your time with removing the engine. Going out the top has it's challenges just as going out the bottom does. I took the engine out the top on my '88, but I disconnected the trany first. So I think that made it a little easier. That's great that you already have the K-member notched. I thought mine was going to work without being notched for the oil pan. WRONG! lol

I was concerned when I looked at that link for that trany shop. It just looks like some shop off of eBay. Maybe they are great. Who knows. All I am saying is do your homework so that you don't get burned. It's better to spend more up front than to have to do it twice like I did. Not all transmission shops are created equal!

Check these guys out http://www.monstertransmission.com/. It looks like they are having a Christmas sale and with free stock converters and free shipping. Not too shabby.

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Well, I wish I could say it was coming along great, but I haven't even had time to mess with it. I have been really trying to focus on my blue '89. I am putting Fatmat throughout the interior of the car and it's taking for-freaking-ever!
Next up is getting the '88 that my son used to drive over to the paint shop. I'd like to get that painted and sold next year. Once that's sold I am going to use the money to put an expensive paint job on my blue '89. So... long story short... the red '89 GTA will be the last in line to get attention unless something changes. Although, I would at least like to see if I can get it running maybe sometime next year. We'll see what happens. Right now I have too many cars!

khulsebus

iTrader: (2)

Things are looking like they are coming along nicely for you. You'll be very happy you switched to a LS once you're finished with the swap.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Pulled the 350 and trans. Pics coming soon

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

So last Friday, it was sort of warm. I decided to take it for one last ride and burn as much gas as I could. I then parked it in the backyard and lifted it. I then began to tackle removing everything from the torque arm to the condenser. First step was the harness so I could begin to attach it to my 2002 firebird body underhood harness.



Unlike most who basically build a harness, I am trying to do this with schematics in mind, with the color wires as close to original and pin locations as close to original. Everything I change I map at the same time...its time consuming, but troubleshooting will be easy.



Being that it was not possible to get the intake off with the motor still in the car, we detached it from the trans and removed them seperatly Sunday Night. It was pitch black outside when we finished.

Yesterday I removed everything else and proceeded to sand and clean the bay, I ended up blasting it. I didn't intend on painting it, but I am gonna have to.
To much damage to the original paint.



Apparently, the distributor was corroded and the trans was on its way out. If I hadn't done this now, this thing could have made me dish out money on a 700r rebuild.



Hopefully all the jinxed drivetrain parts are out of the car.

I have decided I need to pull the dash again to fully integrate and switch over the wiring neatly.

I intend on having the bay in primer by tomorrow and the dash apart by tomorrow as well. ... and the harness in my room haha!



And no the hood is not sitting on just the t-tops, It is protected by several layers of cardboard and insulation and rags

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Nice progress Alex. What color are you painting the engine bay? It appears that the upper part of the back seats are from a turbo t/a. Am I correct?

Here are a couple of things to consider... 1) now would be a good time to flush the brake system real good and clean out that master cylinder and 2) now would be a good time to replace the heater core if it's in question even in the slightest. You can also buy new intermediate steering shafts that go from the steering column down to the gear box if yours had any excessive play in it. It will never be easier than now to change that stuff out. Changing out the intermediate shaft on my car made a big difference in the way it drove. One last suggestion... if you are upgrading the fuel pump I'd recommend doing that last. I did mine first and ended up doing it twice thanks to me taking too long and Ethanol gas. Just my two cents.

scooter

iTrader: (11)

It's the other way around, but yes, the TTA and the Notchback rear seat uppers are the same. The Notch was 88 and the TTA in 89 so...

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Right... I didn't even think about this car being a notchback.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Scooter I just remembered you wanted a pic of the mounting of the notchback hatch, the mounting can only really be seen with it closed. Here is a pic of that for now, when I realign the hatch I will take a pic of that too.

scooter

iTrader: (11)

Thanks, but that wasn't the area I was referring to.

I don't know what the interior plastics are supposed to look like around the hatch strut. I am not sure how the alignment hooks near the glass on the inside interface with the strut bolt is supposed to look like or how the plastics may be modified.
If you get a chance at another time I'd appreciate it

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

I took these today. The new plastics are the same as in non notchback cars. The left side is the same. But because the body shop f-ed up the alignment it is affecting the plastic in that area. ... Gotta find a better shop next time ...

scooter

iTrader: (11)

That's exactly what I was looking for, thank you! I guess I was close, even without knowing what it looked like from the factory. I think I may be missing the "alignment bolts" though

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

But of an update. Its been kinda cold so I brougt my dash harness to my room to make it compatible with my underhood body harness. I figured I would also make it neat as when I installed the bcm it was with the harness still in the car.... Wasn't my best work in terms of neatness. Also I am taking the opportunity to remove all of the tpi wires I.e. The fans, cold start, cruise, and other things I will not need in that harness for what ever the reason. Basically I am thinning out the harness. In the process i figured I might as well pin everything onto the 4th gen style IPC fuse block since it is not labeled (like with inj1,cold start, c/h fans and the like. Because of the similarity between the cars not only are the wires the same colors for the most part but also the old fuse block slides out of the metal bracket and the 4th gen one slides right in. I have spent 4 days making both harnesses look like they came from the factory. It's coming along very well. I am gonna order my trans on Monday. By that time I could have the k-member Assembled with new stock suspension parts. Pics to follow

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Pic of the fuse boxes.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

For the last couple of days we have been trying to find a spring compressor to work with stock f-body springs. My dad had spring compressors from when he removed the springs off for maintenance 20 some years ago, but they seem to have been swallowed up by the earth as we couldn't find them. Finally we found a pair in advance auto that were just the thing.

Yesterday we removed the old k-member, with every piece that comes off another part of the story unfolds. My dad told me that one day many moons ago, when he was looking under the car, he noticed that one of the bolts for the k-member was missing, so he found a bolt with the correct thread and 20 years later I am holding that bolt in my hand.

Any way I cleaned all the bolts and today I worked on getting my wiring harness under the hood in place. Along the way I noticed that the metal bracing that is under the dust cover under the hood latch, the mounting points for it next to the headlights, have cracked on both sides. --The metal cracked. I also had to notch a little in the routing of the harness so it would fit as it is a little bit thicker and the old one bearly slid out to begin with. I am going to ask my dad to weld that area when he has time so no biggie.

Tomorrow, or rather when I waked up in the morning I plan to work on the dash-- getting it back in the car and getting my battery hooked up to check and make sure every thing is working. If I have time, I will reinstall the k-member (well my new one) and then work on making the control arms looking presentable. - along with all new front suspension parts. - nothing wrong with the old stuff, but while I am there, might as well

pics when I upload to photobucket

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

per the suggestion: replacing the heater core with a sprectra premium brand from rockauto

old:



new:



some wiring fun - routing it is always what gets me :mad


no k-member:






heater box in place again and some sealant to replace the 25 year old gasket - no wonder I always had water in my footwells






dash is back home where it belongs



the only thing I screwed up is I did not make the orange wire for the power antenna relay long enough, oh well I guess I have to splice an additional lenth - something I do not like to do, but lesson learned



it looks worst then it really is, just needs to be buttoned up

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

welcome to your new home!!



next step control arms then engine and trans, a light at the end of the tunnel

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Good call on the heater core!

Man, you have wires everywhere! lol. I wasn't having any fun at that point in my build, but it's all worth it in the end. Keep up the nice progress.

khulsebus

iTrader: (2)

Looks like fun. Take your time, attention to detail now makes it look stellar once it's done.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

While I was routing the harness I removed the headlight buckets. I decided to do some detailing especially since when the car was hit on the highway a decade and a half ago and the incident took off the right fender and front bumper, it also ruined the original headlight bucket. I still remember when me and my dad went to the junkyard and found a wrecked formula that was white. Well this bucket and motor are significantly rusted although it worked fine. I decided to take them apart only to have a couple of those screws break off. I managed to save all but 1 hole. Then after I got that one buttoned up, I decided to tackle the left one to detail as well. Well the same exact thing happened even though this one was no where as bad as the right one.


So I can put them together and they will work, but I need to get new ones. I was thinking of finding 4th gen motors from a junkyard, just because the holes might line up, and it will be a cheap fix. I really don't want to dish out 200 bucks on these things right now. All I really need is the damn housing, the insides are clean and perfectly fine.


On a side note, I torqued the k-member today to 72 foot pounds and buttoned up the motor. Tomorrow I want to do a test fit to get all the wiring to motor routed. I also need to put the control arms back on. I was able to drill and tap the alternator hole without any issues, I then test torqued the bracket to ensure the ole is good. Engine is good! I also installed my f-body flexplate.

I need to get a new alternator for it because I am not trusting the one it came with for anything other than driving it around the block. I also need a starter and to send out my pcm for a tune. Then comes the fuel system and after that exhaust.

I have an idea with the throttle cable. I cut the firewall grommet off my old cable and am going to try to form and fit the new one inside the old one. Only time will tell how that goes.

The real kicker, I only have 20 days to finish, cause thats when school starts

The harness in the car is all nice and tidy, I just have to hook up the grounds, screw in the fuse box, and reassemble all my components and then I can bring the electrical system online for a test.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

I tidied more today, but did not take pics...oops.

In a nutshell, I installed the control arms and springs and when my dad came home he tightened the castle nut on the ball joints and cotter pinned them.

I routed my light harness through their holes. I also mounted the headlight module where the firewall relays used to be.

I did a lot of taping and connected most of the grounds under the hood. Tomorrow I will do the rest, then the battery cables, then the wheels. Depending on when the tranny shows up, will decide when the engine goes in. The hood needs to be re installed before it starts raining though. When the rain comes I will spend time hooking up everything inside the car.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

I need help deciding which crossmember to get for my new trans. I have the engine mounts available through Hawks, also seen in the pics above.

should I get this one

http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/tr...60e-automatic/

or this one


http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/tr...tomatic-4l60e/



help, need to get it on order

khulsebus

iTrader: (2)

Just my opinion, build your own cross member. There are a few guys on here that had issues with the hawks cross members.

khulsebus

iTrader: (2)

I took a better look at those two and there really isn't much of a difference. You could build the same in your garage. One thing that I would look for are a torque arm mount, to get the arm off the side of the tailshaft on the transmission. Another thing would be a driveshaft loop.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Ahh, thanks. I guess I will wait till the trans arrives before I go any further with it.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

quick update:

we got the engine in today, and right after that it started snowing so we rushed to put the hood on. It now has an engine, 4 wheels, a suspension system and brake system intact.

Not time to take a pic though

Trans is still in transit, next we'll bolt that up, or I might do it myself, depends if it comes while dad is at work or not.


Then I drop the tank and those crummy old rusted lines

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Pics of the engine:



my dad calls it the LS.5 - haha kind of a running joke


So far everything looks fine. I crawled up underneath to take a look at clearances, so far so good. I have to make sure the brake lines are moved a bit so they are not wedged. Right now they are up against the oil pan and the k-member. I was considering moving them rearward and screwing them in where the oil pan notch is.

I also had my dad weld together an area behind both headlamps on the radiator support. Basically there are these two metal rods that crisscross and where they screw in on top, the metal was so thin it cracked.

I cleaned up all my steam port holes and connected them all. Stock caps on the rear, stock truck crossover on front. I also temporarily installed my manifolds for routing purposes and to get an idea of clearances

I also found my tuck coil packs to be in the way, well #5 is in the way of where the fuel line will go. I cleaned them up after dissassembling them and then I mounted the coil pack like so for now. I will figure something out.



I am also putting together my engine specific harness and I am at the point where I need to hook up my A/C and all my grounds. I really need to power up the body right now, but I am not 100 % ready for that yet. I haven't connected any interior grounds yet and still did not plug in the dash or any switches. Been to focused on the engine.

Hopefully my trans will come tomorrow!

scooter

iTrader: (11)

I cut the brace on the fuel rail that holds the input so I could ever so slightly bend the line so it didn't come directly across the coil.

alex722607

iTrader: (3)

Hmm, thats something to consider. The mod I did is okay to get it running, but I am not to crazy about 1 mounting hole for the coilpack

Trans came in today on a pallet, very nicely wrapped. Let's just hope it shifts as good as it looks.

Came to the conclusion I am going to have to reuse my shifter cable because I don't feel like dishing out money at the moment for the 4th gen shifter. The cable that I had for the 4L60E goes on my shifter okay, but there is nothing to secure it.


I put power to the car today, it seems okay except for a few things that did not work- mostly do to the fact that no switches or even the dash is in the car yet. For some reason my door locks aren't working, I think I forgot to plug in the connector. It was pitch black by the time I got to it and the car lighting wasn't cutting it.

I have a quick question, well two actually.

1. for 4th gen a/c will the heater box in the engine bay have to drastically modified to the poiint that I absolutly need the heater box from the 4th gen, or if I am good with fiberglass, I can get away with out getting the box.

2. For the trans crossmember, has anyone ever tried modifying the stock one from our car's to fit the 4L60E??