Demonic13

iTrader: (-1)

I have a 1991 Camaro Z28 160,000 miles on it. With Shorty headers on it and that's all. I have not had time to get the exhaust pipes added yet. I live in PA and work in NJ.

Question is I work 40 miles away and need to get to work. I have drove the car around so far with no problems for like 20 miles, only doing 40mph or so.

What will happen if I drive the car to and from work for the day? I don't care about it not being legal just want to know if I will damage the motor. Damaging valve etc?

Cosmik Debris

You won't damage anything except your health. You might get carbon monoxide from the exhaust fumes in your cabin.

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

I've aways heard running manifolds with no pipes would burn up exhuast valves, some say shorty headers are the same way.

Can't say its happened to me or anyone I know, but just what I've heard from old timers.

Demonic13

iTrader: (-1)

Your definitely right every time the cabin is filled with smoke. how does it get in the cabin from the out side?

Demonic13

iTrader: (-1)

Same thing here. But the story is different. The story I hear is not burning them up but getting them sucked up it the head somehow?? Just trying to hear if that's true.

Guest

I have done it, you will be fine.
The car on the other hand...

-At long lights it will struggle to keep itsself alive due to fresh air running across the o2 giving a bad reading.
-It WILL run rich (like constant cold motor rich)
-It WILL be loud
-You WILL be surprised every time you fire it up.
-It WILL sound bad
-It WILL get old after 2 days
-You WILL have NO bottom end. (DEAD TPI)
-the window guy at a burger may laugh at you.
-On the freeway it will sound like you have a carbed BBC. (but with torque less tpi power) while tapping the gs a passing cars at WOT with leave a kiddish smile on your face.

Demonic13

iTrader: (-1)

Thanks for letting me know. It seems to run fine for me. I does sound bad like a bad exhaust leak. It is loud in the cabin as well. Hard to have a conversation with the passenger. Music I Blair sucks. I think I am going def but Im working on the piping. I thought I could blow a valve or something

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

The bad thing about running open headers is it can muffle other sounds that can be important to hear, like a ticking valve, or a knocking bearing, detonation, or a police siren, or an ambulance siren.

VincentZ28

iTrader: (2)

If you get pull over you will have a BIG fine for loud exhaust and removal of the cat. The cat will be the biggest fine, $2500.

2007xl50

Alot of old timers say open exhaust will burn a valve, but I have never known anyone to do it. I mean look at drag cars, derby cars, pull trucks, flat bottom power boats, hell my Harley and many many others have open pipes and no engine issues. You will not burn or suck a valve from open exhaust.

Yeah I love loud cars, trucks and bikes, but at some point you will want some sort of exhaust on there for the street. My TA is loud and never had a cop pull me over or look for a cat.

Tibo

iTrader: (15)

If you actually plan to put exhaust on then make an appointment at an exhaust shop and drive it. If you get pulled over say you have an appointment at wherever and the old exhaust rusted off. I have done that with two of the systems that I had put on, I kinda have to drive it to an exhaust shop.

kentuckyKITT

iTrader: (4)

I too have heard of the burning valve thing. I always heard it was winter time was the only time to worry because it would let super cool air in and when super cold air mixes with hot, that causes problems. I don't know though. Half the stuff old timers tell me turn out to be false, while the other half are true.lol

When I installed my new engine, I had nothing but open headers and drove it around the block from a back alley where the garage was to get it up on the trailer to go to the exhaust shop. EVERY person was out of their house on the street looking at me like they were ready to kill me. I had it running for a bit too to get it up on the trailer. It was SUPER LOUD. It was so loud my ears were ringing and it was 105 degrees outside that day and it was just awful. I could not imagine driving it down the road like that.

FtrSpeedy

If outside temp it cold enough you could warp a valve by cooling too quickly.

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Its not "open pipes" that cause the problem, according to the old timers, its the lack of length.

Many of the 'old timers' ran open headers, but said not to do it with manifolds because they are so short.

Demonic13

iTrader: (-1)

I have ran my car with the shorty open headers in the cold as it was snowing around the block to keep the motor running. NO problems at all just a C.E.L. from the 02 sensor and crappier gas mileage it seams and fumes in the cabin. Its not as loud as I thought it was going to be until I drive it with W.O.T. Only problem I have now is a little too much pressure in the cooling system, changing the cap, therm hoses and rad now. Might be a head gasket. What kind of heads do you guys recommend? LOL

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Burning a valve- that depends, it is possible. On an old car with a carb and no way to adjust mixture, if you remove a really restrictive exhaust you end up with more flow, which results in more intake flow and if you don't add more gas it will run lean which can burn the exhaust valves.

Real world, a carb should sense the extra air flow and add more fuel. Not a problem unless you can't add enough. With an ECM the O2 sensor should compensate - and if the sensor is close to the header opening to the air, when you get reversion outside air will wash over it and will either cause it to read lean and the ECM will dump extra fuel or the O2 sensor will cool off and go open loop and you'll usually get extra fuel. The end result, real world it won't be a problem... you will be prone to shooting flames out the open headers under some conditions, but that's a whole different matter...

Demonic13

iTrader: (-1)

I want to thank everyone that helped with the info. I run the car now with open headers and i have no issues. Its loud but fun to drive on the weekends. The smoke was burning oil from where the mechanic forgot to put the dipstick back in. Now that is there, no more smoke and I do not get exhaust fumes in the car either. Thank you all.

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Demonic13 (aka Jason Walsh)...I've tried PM-ing you on here, emailing you and calling you with no response. You bought an MSD distributor from me back on Oct 28, 2013. I shipped it the 29th and you had it on the 30th. This past Monday, Jan 20, 2014, I get notice from PayPal that you're disputing the charge thru your credit card company which has resulted in a chargeback to my PayPal account. While I am confident that this will be resolved in my favor, as I have provided PayPal with copies of all of our communications and UPS tracking information, I'd prefer to get this resolved as soon as possible. I haven't heard anything from you since you sent payment. If there was an issue, I think I would have heard from you before now. If you simply forgot what that charge was on your credit card, I think I would have received something like "sorry, forgot what it was, will cancel dispute." But haven't heard anything. So, I'm left assuming that you're trying to pull a fast one and are trying to screw me. However, that's not going to fly. You've logged onto here since my PM, so I know you've seen at least that attempt by me to reach you. I intend to try and have the positive feedback I left you reversed and will also post this info on the Feedback thread. I'm still hoping this is just a big misunderstanding...maybe this post to one of your threads will catch your attention....

Guest

They WILL reverse his charge back after they investigate. That mess doesn't fly any more...

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Yeah, I'm not too concerned. More annoyed b/c it's such a chicken s#!t thing to do....

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Agree, pretty sad thing to do.

Hope paypal covers you.

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

We'll see. Spoke to a Paypal rep yesterday who said it's between them and Jason's credit card co. now since he filed the dispute with his credit card company. The rep did say he feels it will be in my and Paypal's favor based on all the documentation I provided and that Paypal is as motivated to win as I am bc charge backs like this cost them money as well. Downside is it could take up to 75 days to resolve but nothing I can do there. In the meantime I'll go about my business and let karma do the rest.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

I hope it goes in your favor and quickly Ed. I just wanted to say Ed has my trust I have had a couple great deals with him and sent him cash in good faith . You can sure tell hes a great stand up guy

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Thx Brian!

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Probably all the fumes he has inhaled driving aropund with shorty headers caused him to forget this transaction.

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

LOL Yeah, when I saw this thread, before responding, I had to laugh.

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

I just noticed under his user name it says "Banned"....

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

^ that just happened

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Yeah, apparently so...wow, I guess the mods did that...

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

And I was looking forward to hear him explain himself!

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

As its turns out, the "banned" is b/c he requested to close his account. I asked the mods if the watch emails/IP addresses to prevent him from creating a new user ID and trying to rip someone else off but they never responded....

redneckjoe

maybe running around with open headers landed him in jail or gave him brain damage?

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

He sounds like a female dog in heat.

Any update with the paypal?

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

No updates from PayPal but don't expect any for a bit-they told me that since he disputed the transaction directly with his credit card company, it's in the CC companies hands now and can take up to 75 days before a decision is reached. The PayPal rep I spoke to did feel confident though that it would be in my favor based on what I provided. Just have to wait for now.

However, seems like I have people trying to screw me left AND right -
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/exte...ml#post5716332

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Not to beat a dead horse here, but looking on Craigslist for 3rd gen parts and I happened on this: http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/cto/4378196269.html

This dude Jason, aka Demonic13, is selling his car and in his listing it says "26. Used MSD Distributor Not Installed." Seriously?

Definitely same guy as the phone number he lists is what I have from PayPal and when you go to the flicker account listed in the ad for more pics, the name on the flicker account is Demonic13.
Oh, and this "7. Hedman Shorty Headers (Open header/ loud)."
LMAO What a tool....

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Dang!

Maybe someone in his area can go look at the car and tell him to hand over the msd distributer!

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

He's been driving it with open headers! Ha!

It's got aluminum calibers too!

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Receieved notice today from PayPal that his credit card company ruled in my favor. Glad to see he'll still have to pay for what he purchased!

IROC315

iTrader: (9)

Good to hear. I hate thieves .

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Good to hear!

wwe442

iTrader: (2)

Craigslist ad is gone btw

9340Ruby

iTrader: (7)

That's great! It is people like him that make it hard for everyone else and that's not just on this forum.

Tibo

iTrader: (15)

When this happens in the Chicago area guys will run a Craig's list ad right by the con ad that says this guy is a con, theif, cheat, liar or whatever and say what happened. Might try that anytime you see this guy try anything. I had a guy rip me off and I dogged him for the next year, found him in multiple message boards.

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Yeah, he took his ad down soon after I called him out. I've been watching craigslist in his area though to see if he reposts it. Will be sure to call him out if I see it again.

wwe442

iTrader: (2)

I'm like an hour or so away from him thats why I clicked on the ad to see if the car looked familiar. He might have had a bunch of parts for sale on craigslist a year ago or so

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

I'll have to post the images of his ad when it was on Craigslist (saved screen shots of everything in case I needed it for the dispute). They're saved on my home computer, will try to remember to post tonight.

Ghettobird52

Was following your conflict from the beginning, glad things went in your favor. I don't understand some people today

tnitz8787

You can find other ads by him by putting his phone number in the search box...

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

Here are screen shots of his craigslist ad (hopefully they're large enough, at work so Photobucket is blocked)

Ed1LE

iTrader: (39)

I highlighted the line about the used MSD distributor