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HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Engine SwapEverything about swapping an engine into your Third Gen.....be it V6, V8, LTX/LSX, crate engine, etc. Pictures, questions, answers, and work logs.
HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Hi guys, this car was my first car ten years ago and it is a family heirloom.
it hasn’t driven for ten years because apparently, a chip that’s tied to the vin for that fuel injection engine is lost and it needs that SPECIFIC chip to run. If it cannot be found (it’s lost) than I need to do an engine swap. Allegedly.
will run me around 10k. Two things:
are there any avenues to getting this chip remade, or some way around needing that Exact chip? Do I just need the PROM chip for the corresponding engine size?
if I do have to swap and pay 10k, would that be possible worth it, meaning would the car be worth more than the engine swap? It’s low mileage and all stock, great condition.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
I think you have been misinformed about what is wrong with your vehicle. There is a resistor in the key that is part of the anti theft system (VATS), and there are something like 12 possible resistors it could be. Were the keys lost?
Also, a car that sits for 10+ years will need a thorough once-over including draining the tank of fuel, etc.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by Komet
I think you have been misinformed about what is wrong with your vehicle. There is a resistor in the key that is part of the anti theft system (VATS), and there are something like 12 possible resistors it could be. Were the keys lost?
Also, a car that sits for 10+ years will need a thorough once-over including draining the tank of fuel, etc.
is the level 1 option what you are referring to? It says there is a bunch of required information so I’m guessing that once that’s figured out they custom program it to fit my exact vehicle and that should solve the issue?
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
15 different key resistances values.. so there are 15 different possible chips I need?
Sorry, I'm trying to understand your comment. You're saying that either I need the chip from hawksmotorsports https://www.hawksmotorsports.com/86-...l-for-pricing/ customized, OR, I can get the bypass module you just linked on ebay? Or would I need both?
I found it fishy that he told me there's no possible way to get another chip as it was individualized per the vin. It looks like this link that can tune the chip according to the specifications of the vehicle and then it will work. Is that assumption correct?
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
The vats passkey module has 15 possibilities of resistors used. The hz module will send a frequency needed to enable injectors. Since it’s sat for so long you need injectors anyways but can test for injector pulse with a noid light. Several ways to defeat vats if your just missing the resistor in the key you can get the 15 pack of resistors to try off eBay , a vats delete chip or hz modulator all options.
if you wanting just vats delete and can mail in your computer chip I can do it for much cheaper than the link. But the module or chip reprogram are the best ways to tackle this problem. The key reader bypass still leaves the passkey module in the system as a failure point. Vats is nice to have can always get the resistors have a key cut after you find what resistance is.
If you are missing the memcal I assume this is tpi the aujp would be for 350 automatic. Here’s a list based on gear ratio and engine size and induction. https://www.3rdgenformula.com/92/pro...ar%20to%20year
Last edited by Tuned Performance; 01-25-2023 at 12:20 PM.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by dannyboyz28
I found it fishy that he told me there's no possible way to get another chip as it was individualized per the vin. It looks like this link that can tune the chip according to the specifications of the vehicle and then it will work. Is that assumption correct?
Your assumption is not wholly correct. VATS does 2 things when the right resistor is detected in the key; it sends a square wave to the ECM that allows it to fire the injectors, and it sends a signal to the start enable relay that allows power to reach the starter. If VATS is your problem and you solve those two things, the car will be electrically enabled to start. A PROM with VATS disabled will remove the requirement for the square wave to be sent, which is 1 of the 2 problems you need to solve to disable VATS.
I suppose it's also possible that someone physically removed the PROM in your ECM, in which case you would need a new one and it would need the tune that matches your year and drivetrain, but it's not specific to the VIN so you can just have another one burned and put it in. I would recommend determining precisely what's wrong / missing with the car first, then work on the solution.
Also it is important to note you could really break stuff if you hop in and turn the key on a car that's been sitting for 10+ years, but that's another topic.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by Komet
I suppose it's also possible that someone physically removed the PROM in your ECM, in which case you would need a new one and it would need the tune that matches your year and drivetrain, but it's not specific to the VIN so you can just have another one burned and put it in.
Yes, I believe someone removed the chip and lost it.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
I don't have much of a clue other than it's missing a chip that has something to do with the fuel injection. It was taken out. I don't think it's a chip in the key? I gotta talk to the guy but I'm waiting on his number to be sent to me. My father took the chip out of the car and lost it, as far as I know. And the mechanic is saying that since that chip is lost, I need an engine swap because the chip is tied to the specific car. But I think I just need to get a specific chip, not that it's like a 1 of 1 chip or anything..
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
I think your talking a the ecms chip, if original it has a service number and 4 letters on the same tag showing what chip was used for engine transmission combo.
Last edited by Tuned Performance; 01-25-2023 at 01:54 PM.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by Tuned Performance
I think your talking a the ecms chip, if original it has a service number and 4 letters on the same tag showing what chip was used for engine transmission combo.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Alright I talked to the guy who's got the car.Whole computer is missing.
Without the prom chip to put into a new computer, to make the fuel injection system work, can't start up. I think i found both the computer and the chip.
My question now is: How do I get the broadcast code without the original chip? (it's missing) "Broadcast Code (TPI/93 LT1 Only applicable) ________ (This will be a 3-4 letter code on original chip.)"
Aside from that, my guy says it needs a new wiring harness. and because the chip is in the key, it runs off of the computer and the vin number. The goal is to "trick the computer into thinking it's a wiring harness from the same car"
First step is getting the chip and computer to be able to tell if there are any other issues in the car. It will need new injectors and a new exhaust. But all of this is almost like chinese to me. Can anyone decipher what my guy is saying, and what I need to do?
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Just got pics of the car. This is the first time I've seen this car in 10 years. Kind of pissed. They didn't even keep it under some kind of cover. What the hell
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Here is a pic of the chip in the key. The black plastic with the metal tab in the shank of the key is the chip. This activates the Vats and enables the injectors to pulse.
This is the "prom"that the ECU chip sits in. It is under the blue cover. This is located in the ECU which is located under the dashboard on the passenger side. If this was removed the ECU is probably just laying on the passenger side floor board.
Lastly, the "Chip" this is what gets programmed. This controls way more than just the vats so if either this or the prom are gone it won't do much of anything. Neither of these 2 ECU items have anything to do with a VIN. # specific. The 15 resistor codes do and those are what is in the Key. Hopefully this helps and gives you a visual of what you are looking for when you get to the car. I can with great confidence tell you won't need a engine swap because the only way this fixes your problem is if you go carb!
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by dannyboyz28
Alright I talked to the guy who's got the car.Whole computer is missing.
Without the prom chip to put into a new computer, to make the fuel injection system work, can't start up. I think i found both the computer and the chip.
My question now is: How do I get the broadcast code without the original chip? (it's missing) "Broadcast Code (TPI/93 LT1 Only applicable) ________ (This will be a 3-4 letter code on original chip.)"
Aside from that, my guy says it needs a new wiring harness. and because the chip is in the key, it runs off of the computer and the vin number. The goal is to "trick the computer into thinking it's a wiring harness from the same car"
First step is getting the chip and computer to be able to tell if there are any other issues in the car. It will need new injectors and a new exhaust. But all of this is almost like chinese to me. Can anyone decipher what my guy is saying, and what I need to do?
,
hawks is just selling a adapter that hooks to the memcal. What’s the vins 8th digit?
btw you need a 1227730 ecm I have those as well.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Thanks man, so it sounds like I need to get an ecm computer, a prom chip (I think it's gone but I'll double check) and a key chip? Or, I have to somehow get the key chip to bypass vats so the injectors can pulse, which is where getting a chip that is tuned with vats comes in?
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Another point to make:
The whole reason this computer issue is here is because of an issue in the beginning that likely has nothing to do with the computer. When I was 16, I would put this car into neutral, rev it as high as I could, and shove it into drive to do burnouts.
At some point, my car started not putting out power, and would barely putter down the street sometimes getting gas sometimes not, with the pedal being pushed all the way down. I had to finesse my push of the pedal to get down the street.
THEN my dad started working on it and took out the computer, losing the computer and the VATS issue starting.
SO even if I fix this vats issue the original issue will still probably be there.
My question is, what kind of issue does that sound like? Does that sound like a transmission swap?
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
If hawks has a memcal just have them reprogram the soldered in chip.
it’s uv erased. No need to buy there adapter in conjunction with a memcal.
if it’s a 305 automatic AXXB broadcast code 350 automatic would be AUJP or ANJF would work. Several codes will work for 305 automatic but it’s always a good idea to uses the latest tune released. Hawks charges $200 for a 1227730, $175 for vats delete chip and who knows how much for a real v8 memcal. Cheaper replacement options a 730 ecm working should be $75-100 shipped . Memcals are the harder to find for speed density . I don’t see anything listed on hawks site and scarce on eBay even.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by dannyboyz28
Another point to make:
The whole reason this computer issue is here is because of an issue in the beginning that likely has nothing to do with the computer. When I was 16, I would put this car into neutral, rev it as high as I could, and shove it into drive to do burnouts.
At some point, my car started not putting out power, and would barely putter down the street sometimes getting gas sometimes not, with the pedal being pushed all the way down. I had to finesse my push of the pedal to get down the street.
THEN my dad started working on it and took out the computer, losing the computer and the VATS issue starting.
SO even if I fix this vats issue the original issue will still probably be there.
My question is, what kind of issue does that sound like? Does that sound like a transmission swap?
hard to say if fuel delivery issue or mechanical, bad transmission or broken valve springs. You have a lot of work ahead to get it fixed. I’d figure drop tank, new pump and injectors . Ecm and vats delete to just get a idea what else is needed to fix drivability issues.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by dannyboyz28
Thanks man, so it sounds like I need to get an ecm computer, a prom chip (I think it's gone but I'll double check) and a key chip? Or, I have to somehow get the key chip to bypass vats so the injectors can pulse, which is where getting a chip that is tuned with vats comes in?
The PROM is inside the ECM, so if they weren't separated then you're missing both. It looks like the key is in the ignition and it's been turned so it's right for the car, so don't worry about VATS for now. It's more common for people to have VATS issues than missing computers and it was unclear from your original post what the problem was.
Your first step is to get the right ECM with the correct PROM in it and plug it back in. It is highly likely the original problem with your vehicle was not VATS or the ECM. What you were doing back in the day is called a neutral drop, and it's a great way to destroy a transmission. So, likely a rebuild or replacement there, but that's something you'll need the car running to diagnose.
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Not to be an a**h*** but are we in La La Land here?
The least of your concerns should be the ECM. Easy fix.
However, by the look of it, you are going to need more than an ECM to get it going! I would try turning the engine manually first. Then if turns, I would put a battery in it and check for fire, smell and look for smoke. Then, I would check the engine oil and maybe drain it to see what it looks like, might find pile of water. Then I would use a starter by pass device to activate the starter see how it turns. If you make it that far, not so bad. Then maybe look at the body see if not too rotten. And then, maybe see how the wheels are turning
I would not spend any money on an ECM before you do all that. If you are satisfied, you have more work ahead of yourself before even thinking about starting that engine.
Fuel tank needs removal and assessment
Fuel filter needs change
Injectors are probably shot
Fuel pump probably shot
Brake system probably shot
Tires are probably dry rotted
Would look for mice nests (air box) and wire damage from rodents
And if you ever get it going, there is probably so much mold inside, you'd probably get yourself sick breathing in it... not counting mice droppings.
And if you make it that far, after driving it for a bit everything is going to start falling apart since it sat so long.
Just the brutal reality before you spend $500 on ECM and EPROM
__________________ Never give up! You might not fix the problem but you will learn a lot. '91 Firebird Formula 383 First TPI T56 Restomod '89 Camaro IROC-Z LB9 T5 Stock
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by SbFormula
Not to be an a**h*** but are we in La La Land here?
The least of your concerns should be the ECM. Easy fix.
However, by the look of it, you are going to need more than an ECM to get it going! I would try turning the engine manually first. Then if turns, I would put a battery in it and check for fire, smell and look for smoke. Then, I would check the engine oil and maybe drain it to see what it looks like, might find pile of water. Then I would use a starter by pass device to activate the starter see how it turns. If you make it that far, not so bad. Then maybe look at the body see if not too rotten. And then, maybe see how the wheels are turning
I would not spend any money on an ECM before you do all that. If you are satisfied, you have more work ahead of yourself before even thinking about starting that engine.
Fuel tank needs removal and assessment
Fuel filter needs change
Injectors are probably shot
Fuel pump probably shot
Brake system probably shot
Tires are probably dry rotted
Would look for mice nests (air box) and wire damage from rodents
And if you ever get it going, there is probably so much mold inside, you'd probably get yourself sick breathing in it... not counting mice droppings.
And if you make it that far, after driving it for a bit everything is going to start falling apart since it sat so long.
Just the brutal reality before you spend $500 on ECM and EPROM
All this and then some. Mine set for 17 years, several thousand $$$ later and doing great. Still plenty to go though. GL OP and really think about if your prepared for the cash you'll end up spending. I know mine is a sentimental thing question is are you that attached???
Re: HELP NEEDED! Z28 1992 needs engine swap because missing chip?
Originally Posted by SbFormula
Not to be an a**h*** but are we in La La Land here?
The least of your concerns should be the ECM. Easy fix.
However, by the look of it, you are going to need more than an ECM to get it going! I would try turning the engine manually first. Then if turns, I would put a battery in it and check for fire, smell and look for smoke. Then, I would check the engine oil and maybe drain it to see what it looks like, might find pile of water. Then I would use a starter by pass device to activate the starter see how it turns. If you make it that far, not so bad. Then maybe look at the body see if not too rotten. And then, maybe see how the wheels are turning
I would not spend any money on an ECM before you do all that. If you are satisfied, you have more work ahead of yourself before even thinking about starting that engine.
Fuel tank needs removal and assessment
Fuel filter needs change
Injectors are probably shot
Fuel pump probably shot
Brake system probably shot
Tires are probably dry rotted
Would look for mice nests (air box) and wire damage from rodents
And if you ever get it going, there is probably so much mold inside, you'd probably get yourself sick breathing in it... not counting mice droppings.
And if you make it that far, after driving it for a bit everything is going to start falling apart since it sat so long.
Just the brutal reality before you spend $500 on ECM and EPROM
01-24-2023, 10:46 PM
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