83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

87 TA, LB9 (305 TPI)

It's slowly been getting harder to start, by I started noticing it early summer when after a week or 2 of sitting it wouldn't start. That time period has been getting shorter. A couple of weeks ago it was 3-4 days of sitting would be enough that it wouldn't start, the other night it wouldn't start after a few hours. By wouldn't start it would crank over like normal for about a half a crank and slow down fast, till after turning over a couple of times it wouldn't turn over at all.

electrical changes in the last year or so:

• new radio/speakers
• STS sequential taillights
• Crane Hi6 ignition and matching coil
• swapped alternators (took the one out of my '87 formula)
• new high torque starter

what I've tried:

• pulled the negative terminal and hooked an ammeter inline, i'm annoyed because in both the 10A and the mA range it reads ~2.5 (but I'm pretty sure it's actually 2.5A), I'm guessing that the cold weather and the old battery might be the reason that the time it takes to die is getting shorter, but I'm pretty sure that I should be seeing something below .5A
• things that didn't show any change:
  • disconnected the battery connection on the Crane ignition
  • unplugged the ipod
  • pulled all the fuses and breakers from the under dash fuse box one at a time
  • pulled both connections from the alternator

Any thoughts what to try next???


I didn't pull the starter connection because it's a pain to get to and I can't really do it where the car is sitting right till it gets warmer (if someone has an idea how to check it without getting under the car I'm all ears)


The STS box quit working sequentially, but I doubt that could be it since the car wiring shouldn't be sending any power back there without the lights on/brakes on anyway.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Oh, other reason that I don't think its the starter- that was replaced late summer because the old starter was getting cranky anyway and needed a mini-starter, it started having problems before I replaced it, the high torque mini starter seemed to make it better for a while, mostly because it was stronger than the old stocker that was in there, it turned the engine over better using less power.

Edwardgp

One time I had a horn relay that got stuck and would drain the battery. Depending on the amount of driving I would do in a day seemed to directly relate to how fast the battery would go dead. Less driving= less charging battery would go dead faster.

Damien00677

The cheapest/easiest/fastest thing to do would be to take the battery out and have the local parts store check it, right? You mention its an old battery, so even if that's not it, it rules it out. Sounds like it may be at least part of the problem if the condition is worsening.

If you jump it, does it start ok, or does it take a bit of effort while jumping to get it to start?

mrrman

I am having the same issue, I feel your pain. Havent quite found my problem area yet.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

cheapest... maybe, maybe not

even if it has a week battery that's not the problem with a 2.5amp draw, and if I drop a new battery in it if I let it sit a few days I'll hurt that battery. Might as well figure out the real problem first.

didn't think about it, but that is a funny question, jumping it off my truck (a cummins dodge with 2 batteries and BIG alt, a lot of power) and off of a friend's car it took some effort, had to sit a while before it would start, but off of my charger with a 50A jump circuit, both times it started right off by the time I had a chance to get in the car (of course, that wasn't right away, the 50A start circuit almost never will start a car on it's own). Don't know what that means, that's pretty backwards that a lot of power and big cables doesn't seem to work as well as the wimpy charger.

Damien00677

By cheapest I meant getting it tested, not getting a new one.

I asked about the jumping because my current pickup had one of those shorts that caused the wire harness to start on fire, and it was always very difficult to jump. One time I even ignited the paint on the alligator clip of my jumper cable. In my case, the short happened on the power side of the fuse block, so pulling fuses didn't make any difference. The part about the charger is a bit confusing though.

I could be wrong, but;
Sounds like you need to just start disconnecting systems. When you pulled fuses the first time, did you measure the current draw after pulling each one? 2.5A doesn't seem like a whole lot to me though, and isn't even enough to pop any fuses in our fuse block. Seems like a system that's just continuing to operate after the car is shut down. Is your stereo staying on? Do you have an amplifier that is not shutting down with the car but just sitting in standby mode? a light bulb that is malfunctioning? Dome light on? I think those are the things to look for.

NINÅ

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

bayonet fuse? I seem to remember a small fuse there going to the ECM, is that what you're talking about or something else.

Good idea on the IR thermo, especially when cold out, but 2.5A draw should be putting out about the same heat as a 40watt bulb...

mrrman

[quote=83 Crossfire TA;5189414]bayonet fuse? I seem to remember a small fuse there going to the ECM, is that what you're talking about or something else.

Where is this fuse by the ECM? I didnt see one on my car. Can someone post a pic. Thanks

sailtexas186548

iTrader: (2)

I'd double check that with another multimeter since it sounds like it's malfunctioning (or user error?). The general procedure i use for this stuff is hook up the meter, pull one fust at a time untill the meter says zero. then you know what circuit to check.

You may also want to check your radio, they pull a small amount through the "always hot" 12v source to keep your presets ad clock saved. disconnet the radio and see what happens.

I also say get a new battery, 4 years old, has been getting drained and recharged recently... Time for a new one soon, might as well eliminate that possibility now

NINÅ

Edwardgp

I had a brand new battery that was defective one time, had a hell of a time trouble shooting that thinking that was a good strong battery.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Well it gets weirder...

I ended up taking apart the inlet tract and pulling the alternator to reconnect it, put it all together and found that I no longer had the power draw. I decided that I'll just reconnect everything with the battery, pull the charger and see what happens.

Well it worked for a while, even after sitting for 3 or 4 days it started, then I took it on a couple of trips, drove it to the gym, work... and then yesterday morning, well it isn't starting again... arg...

Haven't had time to disconnect the battery and check for the power draw again.

Edwardgp

Well at least you know the battery and alternator are good let us know, keep us up to date.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Well, I'm stumped... ended up with a no start condition again a few times, disconnected the battery and didn't see enough of a load on it sitting there to make a difference. Then suddenly the battery when from being OK to having no load capacity even when it was fully charged, it just wouldn't start the car and this time it failed a load test.

Replaced the battery and it has been fine, but it's incredibly unsatisfying to just not have a good explanation for what was going on. Rigth now I'm leaning towards something like an intermittent short in the battery and I'm hoping my problems with it have gone away, but I really don't know for sure

Edwardgp

Well run it for a few days and carry jumper cables and let us know what happens.

libolt

I had something kind of similar happen with my TA. I had a battery that was 4 and 1/2 years old. If I didn't start and run the car every day or two the battery would go dead. I would then charge it up and be able to start it again. Then recently I bought a Battery Tender and hooked it up for a few days. Went to start it and all I got was fast clicking with the interior lights flashing, which it had Never done before. I tried to charge it up with the regular charger and got the same thing. Then I swapped in the battery from my 2003 Grand Am and it's been fine ever since.

Needless to say old batteries can cause weird problems.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Eh, bought a jumper box when I bought the battery...