Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

0-5 V and RS232 output for data-logging and feedback control , so yes it will but would require formula setup and verification of accuracy vs gauge in Tp.

SbFormula

Ok, I'll check it out when I get a chance.
I might installed a wire in hush panel so I can connect and disconnect gauge.
Another project!!!
Thanks

EDGE

Here's my first log. No driving. It hot started a bit better when I knocked some of the fuel off in the PW vs CT

SbFormula

Cool!
Do you have the .xdl?
Thanks

EDGE

I do but it won't let me upload it. I can email it to you if you PM me your email address.

SbFormula

Looking at your log, a few pointers. I am not saying that is what is causing the problem, just something I nocticed:

Your Cell#0 (idle cell IIRC) is at 147. So it is lean. If you reset the ecm, the BLM will go back to 128 and will affect your start-up, making it leaner
IAC while cranking indicated 160 steps, once engine is declared "RUNNING", IAC goes to 53 (seems normal to me for hot engine)
It seems RPM never settles to desired RPM idle, IAC goes as low as 13
Your idle was lean from 20secs on in open loop. Commanded AFR is at 14.4 and BLM at 147 at that point.
Your MAF g/sec seems good, nice 350 breathing good.
When you tap the gas pedal at sample 792 and 818, you encountered lots of knock events resulting in knock retard (KR). Can't tell you if it's real knock or not. Might want to keep an eye on that.
Your average O2 mv in closed loop at idle was 743mv, so, at first glance, it's on rich side but it depends on how your tune is set-up and what an AFR gauge would say. Sometimes you need a higher cross point to make idle smoother. Now you want to take this with a grain of salt as you did tap the gas pedal. If you want a real average, it's important not to touch the gas pedal.

EDITED: CT went to 204Deg.F, fan did not come on. Do you have 180Deg.F? If yes, you may want to lower your fan to 190Deg.F.
What is your initial timing on engine and in your tune? You know they have to match right?

So you have to keep playing with INJ PW vs CT at cranking. The lower the number, the less gas you will get and vice versa. Reduce a small percentage at the time and see what it does. Also, with that BLM cell#0 at 147, if it ever resets to 128, it will pull fuel immediately after start-up and might make the engine stumble. Keep that in mind during your testings.

I have a feeling, your MAF tables are too lean at idle.

SbFormula

Just curious. Was your hood open during your log? Your MAT did not heat soaked while idling.
Thanks

EDGE

My hood is not even on the car at this point so yes, it's indeed open

SbFormula

What's is your distributor?
HEI remote coils?
New ICM?

SbFormula

Seems like you reached over 300rpm at cranking within a seconds.
I see you tapped the gas pedal a bit during cranking.

If you ever want to use a AFR gauge, you need to divert A.I.R.S. (smog pump) temporarily for accurate readings.

Do you still have AIRS?

EDGE

I have full emissions and my ignition is MSD cap, rotor, remote coil, Delco module, factory distributor with a new Delco pickup coil and shimmed, and Taylor wires. All brand new.
As for the Knock. That may be my exhaust banging around because I feel it whacking around under the floor. The Cats loose where the collector meets it. I'll have to address that but if I feel it odds are so to does the sensor.

SbFormula

Apologies if I am repeating myself, it's been a long thread

May I suggest once you start tuning SA, you use these values for your latency table:

RPM usec
800 213.64
1200 274.68
1600 305.20
2000 244.16
2400 274.68
2800 305.20
3200 259.42
3600 228.90
4000 198.38
4400 167.86
4800 152.60
5200 213.64
5600 274.68
6000 274.68

Please read: https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...ncy-table.html

EDGE

Thank you for all that. The help and advice is more than appreciated.

SbFormula

If you feel like adding MAF voltage to your data stream please read the following:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...f-voltage.html

You need to modify your BIN and ADX. IMO, it is very worth it.

I've had MAF voltage failure but I could not see it on datalogger and no SES code. ECM will revert to other means (too complicated to explain) and still show a value for MAF g/sec. However, that value could be wrong. I also had aftermarket MAF with different voltage scale which screwed up the whole tune.

To me, and it's my personal preference, I always want to see MAF voltage when trouble shooting or tuning.

SbFormula

Here's a tool I use to tune MAF tables
Enjoy!

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

It basically converts to Alpha-N which derives and substitutes a MAF value from the RPM and TPS.

EDGE

So it turns out I'm a bit of a Moron. I have no idea how, why, or whatever the reason...epic farting of The Brain I guess....but my timing was set to 6 degrees ATDC!!! I set it to 8 degrees BTDC and made the change to the BIN as well. Boy does it run better and even starts when it's hot...instantly. Imagine that Made another Log to see what changed.

EDGE

I don't have a Spark Latency table in my BIN. At least I don't see the option unless it's under a different name.

SbFormula

Send me your XDF by email please.
Thanks

EDGE

Sent!

SbFormula

... hahaha!

It happens, I've done worst! Slap yourself and move on

That is a reminder on how hard it is to diagnose problems over the internet. With tuning, you can never assume that one has everything correct. So the questioning is endless.

First thing I do before tuning is:
Complete tune-up and inspection
Timing check including type of distributor and ICM, is ESC/EST still there?
Fuel pressure check and confirm injectors size/rating
Injectors ohm check when hot
O2 sensor check (if old, may as well put a new one)
Confirm thermostat temp
Check voltage on/off, idle and 2000rpm
Check vacuum
Could throw a compression test, that would not hurt.
Are emission components and VATS still there (EGR, AIRS & CCP)?
BIN data verification (engine size, injector size, AFR, etc, etc, etc....)
Initial BIN modification based on what is known
Then first datalog with AFR gauge if possible, including at standardize WOT pass to confirm acceleration times, and the damn MAF voltage!
Analyze all values/data to see if they make sense
Start tuning!!!!

You might want to zero-out scalar 0X23 ALDL Spark Adder (again, my apologies if I already told you that). EDITED: it's called Spark Advance Added in ALDL in your XDF

Enjoy

EDGE

Thank you Sir

EDGE

So what must be some 50+ tunes later that began on Feb 2nd, I can finally say my GTA is tuned. @SbFormula I cannot thank you enough for the time and patience in getting this right. And not to mention the education along the way. See this post for more details:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...ified-l98.html

I can say with absolute certainty that this part of the process is a lot more involved than simply dropping in a tune, reading a sticky, and bumping a few numbers. It's an artform to say the least. I did manage to get it running and driveable through my own research on here and with the advice of so many like @Tuned Performance @RBob to name a few. But the learning curve is incredibly steep. I've just managed to scratch the surface. The amount of data is astonishing given the era of these cars. SBFormula brought this thing to the finish line. Night and day from Day 1. Really glad I had a very big hand in understanding exactly what was going on. One thing is for sure. Screwing up here is a surefire way to torch an engine.