robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

anymore updates? just trying to keep this fresh.

SATURN5

/Patiently waits for boost provisions to be added..

JPrevost

The software is still a little buggy but nothing serious. Works with the Radio Crack USB - Serial adaptor and I should be testing it with a Belkin adaptor late next week.
I'll let Bob talk about the hardware. Here's a peek.

BMmonteSS

Ummm yummy!

I see a socket for a calpack. I thought this would eleminate it to use a 28 pin chip with all the code on the chip?

JPrevost

The calpack doesn't have any code on it. It's just a network of resistors needed to operate the engine. Without it you will through a code.

justlearning

is that an ethernet port?? it says serial but it looks kinda like a com port to me. did u need that extra ecm i was talking about earlier on this page?

John

JPrevost

No it's not an ethernet port (rj45), it's infact a serial port. We're using a telephone cable (rj11) to go from the ecm into an rj11-serial adaptor which plugs directly into the serial port . We don't need the extra ecm but thanks for the offer.

Dominic Sorresso

Jon,

Is it that USB just isn't feasible? I mean its becoming more difficult to find a serial port on a laptop.

Teeleton

rj9? You sure? rj9 is the connector from the phone to the handset. rj11 is from the phone to the wall.

Teeleton

RBob

iTrader: (1)

For now the Embedded Lockers baord will be a serial output. I wanted to get the product out there with minimal development time. There is a plan to do a USB version down the road. I have been looking at what it will take to add a USB port to the board.

If need be moates.net has a $30 serial to USB convertor that can be used. Jon has been using a serial to USB adaptor that is working. Not sure which one.

You are correct, it is an RJ11 jack and cord. I actually used that setup on the wire-wrapped prototype Lockers board. It makes for a nice connection.

I know folks are waiting for an update: I have several units built, tested and installed in ECMs. I will be contacting the beta testers later today. The first Embedded Lockers (EBL) has been in the ElCamino all last week being driven around. I did data logging and some display work with out issue.

I am still working on the calibration table document. But a lot has been added to it. Not much more to go. Jon's HUD really looks good. It is usable as is, with some additional features and functionality being added.

RBob.

va454ss

iTrader: (1)

You guys didn't by chance eliminate the underhood ESC module with this, did ya?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

The ESC module stays where it is, either under the hood or next to the ECM (full size vans). Were you thinking that the ESC was possibly incorporated onto the EBL's board?

RBob.

va454ss

iTrader: (1)

Yes, hoping. Like the P4's, I assume.

va454ss

iTrader: (1)

I wasn't aware that GM ever had it anywhere other than underhood.

Engine compartment is much less cluttered without the ESC.

lostreception

will this work with a fullsize chevy g20 van. i have one of those too LO5 1227227

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Maybe 1227747? If so, yes, the EBL setup will replace it.

RBob.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

When I get ahold of one that is where mine is going. But I am using a 846 out of a Camaro right now. I added 1 wire for the IAT sensor and added the sensor to the air cleaner.

My Cardomain Site

lostreception

yes my mistake its the 1227747

thanks

robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

ttt

JPrevost

Well I'm the hold up for beta testers. My software wasn't handling file's very well. Crashing looking for a file that isn't on everybody's computer (bin, playback, datalog files). SOo, I've been working on it and come up with a version that will work. It will ask for all of the files each time you restart/load/run the program. This "problem" is on the top of the list.
Sorry for the delay.

Teeleton

No sweat. A smooth launch is the exception, unfortunately.

Teeleton

DM91RS

Originally posted by RBob.........

For now the Embedded Lockers baord will be a serial output. I wanted to get the product out there with minimal development time. There is a plan to do a USB version down the road. I have been looking at what it will take to add a USB port to the board.

If need be moates.net has a $30 serial to USB convertor that can be used. Jon has been using a serial to USB adaptor that is working. Not sure which one.
......................................................................................................


What signal will this box use since the data is not going to be the same as the aldl from the std computor? It will be a serial signal correct? The moates box changes the aldl output to what? serial then to usb? It would be nice to use it since there are several of us using it.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Originally posted by RBob............

I am still working on the calibration table document. But a lot has been added to it. Not much more to go.
.......................................................................................................

What tuner will this use? Tunerpro or Tunercat or both?

Thanks.........DM

elkabong

If you guys are interested in testing with a 383, TFS heads, decent cam, 2.13TBs and 90# injectors let me know. I can send you my 7747 for rework. I has the HAM adapter to work with the 84 Vette wiring harness.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

For the serial to USB convertor there are two type of devices that will work. The most common being a serial to USB convertor cable. These can be picked up nearly anywhere. Will use the output from the RJ11 jack, which is an RS-232 serial data stream.

The other type is two units that moates.net carries. Both convert from 5V serial signal to USB. The ADL1 is one such unit. The other is listed under the honda stuff. That one is cheaper but doesn't have a box. This signal is available on the terminal strip. THere are actually 3 serial outputs on the EBL: two RS-232 and one 5V, all the same data stream.

The calibration table document lists and explains what each of the calibration table parameters are for. Currently a very complete ECU file is ready. This will work with editors such as WinBin, Promedit and TunerPro. Later I will be making a TDF file for use with TunerCat.

RBob.

DM91RS

Thanks for the info Bob.

The 5V. output answered my question on connection.

My bad on the document.........I thought that you were still working on the ECU.

Pretty cool that the calibration table document lists and explains what each of the parameters are for.

Sounds like I'll be trying to get Tunerpro rt up and emulating. I've never used it eventho I've had it since the spring. There seems to be more tables available with TP compared to TC. But after using TC since 2001 the way the tables are setup will take some getting used to on my part.

Like I said thanks again!!

DM

Dominic Sorresso

DM,

I used TC for years. But with TP RT 4.0, I never use it now.

DM91RS

That's cool to know.......I guess it's just hard to teach an old dog new tricks sometimes.

Might as well go out now an try to emulate with it since it's all there's going to be to begin with with the EBL.

As a side note since the my last post I've thought more about connecting to the new lockers board and the 5V terminal. I thought since I have parts cars just pull the aldl socket from one and wire it into the 5V and continue to use the Moates ALDU1 just as before. No further parts needed.

Mangus

www.ftdichip.com

Dirt simple, with minimal change/addition to your hardware, and you get to keep your UART implementation. ;-)

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Yes, checked those parts out. Problem is the operating temperature range. Absolute Maximum Operating Temperature range before damage to the device can occur is 0° C to 70° C (http://www.ftdichip.com/Documents/Da...s/ds232b17.pdf, page 11).

Not something that can be put into an ECM. Believe me, I've looked. Unless it is the proper part I won't design it in.

RBob.

Dominic Sorresso

My hero.

Mangus

Not sure who would, at least around here.

Gladstoneiroc

iTrader: (1)

Does everyone open their email and click on the link hoping today will be the day? Only to be more and more teasing. I can't wait, you guys are doing an awesome job and keep up the good work. I think we are already to "see the light."

DM91RS

Seems like the more features that you add the more the cost climbs also (USB). It's not like something new unless you've never gotten the hardware to datalog at all. I know some people have had issues with the usb/serial adapters but I'll give Craigs unit another plug as I've never had any issues with it from day one. Hopefully the EBL will have the same user friendlyness.


I can hear Santa now..............what the h*** is an EBL?


DM

robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

hey guys anything new?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Waiting on Jon for the HUD. . .

RBob.

91RedFirebird

Have you guys got a round about price yet? I would like to set aside some money for it, my car needs this bad.

robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

hey jon let`s get crackin buddy ,chop chop! JK

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

Never could get it to work on my laptop, especially now that it has to have winME. XP doesnt agree with the hardware controlling the cooling fan on it.

Dominic Sorresso

I haven't had a problem with using it on my Compaq with XP SP2. Are you having a problem with it connecting with the ECM? I haven't ued it for that. With EBL it'll be a moot point since Jon's HUD will be the scantool.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

It connects fine to the pc and works well in that regard, but the programs features dont work correctly. The dash feature does all sorts of wierd things and the ALDL monitor is all scrambled. The ony datalogging feature that works is just the plain ALDL values display. I understand that he cant make the software work for every combination of software and hardware out there.

DM91RS

Datalogging is not too good for me either using TP.

But......as Dom recommended I've started using the editor and emulating features and things are going well. I went to Craig Moates site and found a later XDF for the 8746 and the Main Fuel Table 1 has all the numbers in the correct locations now. The tables did not match TC previously as in the values would come up in other cells.

DM91RS

Oh yeah I forgot to state that this is with XP.

It looks like new laptops are getting very affordable as I seen several in yesterdays adds for $399 so XP will be used by more and more people.

BillZ

Huh, kids. My first was a Kim1 that I hot-rodded by soldering an extra 1K of memory on top of the existing parts. Hand assembled the code and punched in hex bytes on the keypad. Now THAT was a programming!

Nice work RBob, I'm waiting for the 749 version for my 928! (I can help with that if needed)

BTW - how are you building the surface mount boards? Hand soldering? Toaster oven ( http://articulationllc.home.comcast.net/sm0402.htm )? Or do you have access to a real reflow oven?

JPrevost

The tricky part with this programming is that there is a lot of data to be processed and displayed. Fifo serial buffer is REQUIRED. This shouldn't be an issue with most but some old equipment might not have it and even the newer stuff might not have the buffers turned up. I've given the program a high priority so it shouldn't "miss" any data even on the slowest of machines.
Finally got file handling done with Bob yesterday so he's got a working version to ship out to beta testers.
"Autotune" works but doesn't update to Romulator/Ostrich/Autoprom and it doesn't even let you save the new bin... YET. It's high priority that I get that all done but if you've used WinAldl and found it useful you'll find this program similar in most respects... only about a 230x more data .
The knock "Autotune" is disabled BUT there is a chart showing you an accumulator of the knock counts the size of the main SA table + extended SA table. Meaning you look at that chart and the end of a run and you'll know where you might have too much timing . Features will be added later as low priority because I'd much rather have rock solid framework in the background.
LabView = efficient but not easy to make dumby proof. Most of the time this language is written BY the user, not for a user . Great for me, bad for you. But not because I'm working my butt off over hear.
In a little bit I'll post some screen shots.

Mangus

You can set the FIFO buffers programmatically.

Dimented - I've never seen nor heard of such issues with the dash or ALDL monitors. The only thing I can think of is that your graphics chip in your laptop doesn't support bitblt'ing, which, if that's true, its time to get a new laptop, dude. =)

Those two controls (the dash and monitor controls) draw using GDI - the most common method for 2D drawing across all the Windows operating systems. Nothing special there (except for bitblt'ing to reduce flicker, but I didn't think there were any chips in at least the last 10+ years that don't support that. Go figure!).

K. Back to the topic at-hand.

JPrevost

Hmm, thanks. Now to find out how through LabView.

Dominic Sorresso

Jon,

You may want to contact =Jeff=. He's worked with it also.

Mangus

Mmm, Labview. Forgot about that. Good luck with that (and the same poor souls whose laptops don't support bitblt).

Maybe their API is kind and is similarly named? If so, look for SetupComm.

M

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

I tried it again and it worked ok. Aside from some issues with the menues not appearing untill I drag my curser over them, it works.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Things are looking up. The HUD is definitely usable and EBL systems are going out to the beta testers. The issue with the serial com and FIFO's is not as serious as it seems. I did some further testing with various serial programs along with the HUD.

With the EBL I am including a DOS based program that is designed just for logging. The COM routines are written in assembler for speed. Booted to DOS on a 20MHz 386SX this program can log to disk the Lockers data stream without any data loss.

What is interesting is that on a 450MHz P3 this same program under Windows (NT4.0) can just keep up. It works, but is on the edge. This program (HDS) also enables the UART FIFO buffers. Windows adds so much overhead to the sserial stream, it can kill it.

On this same machine (450MHz P3) the HUD can not keep up with the serial data. It is capable of playing back and crunching a data log without issue. The other PC that Jon and I were using is a 300MHz AMD K6. It can not data log with the HUD, but plays back fine (this machine is a dog). A little slow, but usable.

So, where does that leave us? Someplace above 450MHZ and around a GHz (maybe) the HUD will receive and display the serial stream live. For testing all I have available to me is either slow PC's (300 and 450MHz). Or, a fast PC: 2.4GHz P4. The fast PC just eats up the serial data and displays without issue.


As it is I was never a fan of live tuning (unless on a dyno). With the availability of fast laptops coming down in price, along with the HDS program to log on any old laptop, all is good.

RBob.