WTR388

Well, I'm a bit quiet on this board, but I have an 87 T-Top T/A. I've done a lot of work to it, including replacing floors 2 years ago (and part of a sub frame, bottom of the a-pillars along the floor inside and out etc). I have an LS1/T56 swap, 4th gen axle with some goodies etc. I was at the dyno last week getting a tune done after a cam swap and long tubes, injectors etc and the stock drive shaft (the only thing stock left in the drive line of course) blew up in to 3 pieces. One put a fist sized hole right through the floor over the tail of the trans, it looks like no console damage. The other parts of the shaft pushed the torque arm to the drivers side floor, and split a big section of the floor longitudinally and even pulled it away from the big subframe extention in the rear (sort of like a big doubler that wraps around the back portion of the floor). It really, really has me bummed.
The drive shaft let go at approx 6000rpm in 4th gear on a pull, so it was spinning pretty good. Luckily a buddy showed up with a quality aftermarket one to finish the test day up... And it is now in my car. He saved my butt for sure.

With everything this car has, the parts that are in it are worth $$$ as I was trying to get this thing car of the month worthy. Essentially what I had left to do was my suspension and I was planning on a full strip of the body and one last quality paint job.

That said, I found some more rot in the spare tire area, in the rear of that wheel well basically, there are a few layers of car that come together there. The bottom of the A-pillars have started to bubble, bottom of the rad support is no good, and I've had to do a couple patches on the strut towers etc.

Selling this car as/is, is not an option as I will not get my dollar out of the car with the work required, and then I have to find and build all of these components again (even the T56 has upgrades and a very fresh rebuild).

Now, I live in Canada guys, so rust free cars almost don't exist when it comes to third gens. And if there is a rust free car it is on the road and in too good of shape for me to get a deal on as I plan to strip it down and start over anyways. The same buddy with the drive shaft has what appears to be a pretty much rust free fire bird shell. It's already gutted, so that saves me all that work and it's cheap. Only problem is, is that it is a hard top. Which just doesn't seem right to me on a 3rd gen.

So, I'm planning on looking at this shell. If it really is clean and doesn't require work on the bottom, I'm considering taking it and doing a roof swap. FYI, I do structural repair and maintenance on military helicopters, welding, painting etc. So while it is work to swap a roof, I would rather do that than spend time on my back cutting, grinding, welding to get my shell up to snuff... I have to strip mine to nothing anyways if I were to do so.
It won't be a hack job, I will do my best to use factory spot weld locations and plan on only one cut line that isn't in a factory joint (high up on the A-pillars since mine have corrosion) Even that cut will be done to do a proper splice for strength.

The car will then get a full paint job and will transfer over all my T/A ground effects and everything else to make it right.

I think money wise, even if I find a cherry car on the road for 3g, since I'm stripping to a shell anyways, it makes sense to go this way. Yes, I might be able to sell parts off a full car to get some money back, but there isn't a huge market here and it takes time, plus I have to deal with people.

drknow90rs_ss@y

iTrader: (3)

From the amount of damage done to your car, I think you might have the right idea with the roof swap. Overall, it sounds like a lot less work. I think it's the way I would go, in your situation. Maybe put a driveshaft safety loop on the new car, though, it doesn't sound like it would have helped, in this case, anyway.
What sort of numbers did she make on the Dyno?
DR.K.

WTR388

As far as I can tell, it looks like the shaft initially broke at the yoke at the trans, and then when it rotated around it smashed halfway down the car and snapped there and then it just beat up the bottom of the car as the dyno slowed down. I at least got it on video! Told the guys at the shop before we started to tune that if the car is going to break I wanted it to break at the dyno instead of the street. I did put in heavy duty u-joints the week before, so I doubt it was a u-joint that caused it.

Not sure if I will put a driveshaft loop in the new car, new drive shaft is rated for 1200hp. But, I might fab one up.

Car made 381hp 360tq. Corrected it was almost 400 (was a warm, humid day).
Power curve is nice and flat. I did take it for a drive after we unstrapped from the dyno (I didn't know how much damage was under the car yet) and it is super smooth, and even a little bit of throttle from 2500rpm in 4th gear it pulls nice. Haven't been able to play with it yet, have about a year to go now to do that.
Was also my first drive with the new ls1 rear which helped as well, nice to have the rear end spin both wheels.

drknow90rs_ss@y

iTrader: (3)

Oh, man! You have to post that video, or a link to it, anyway. Those are great numbers, and a flat curve is pretty awesome! At least it's still driveable, despite the damage. Post up some pictures.
DR.K.

WTR388

I'm so bummed I'm not wanting to crawl under the car to take pictures lol. Honestly I did get lucky that nothing on my trans broke (its worth at least 4g up here in Canada) and the rear end is damage free as well. All the expensive stuff survived... And I know the motor handled hitting off the rev limiter too.

I'll try and throw the video up on to here.

Only good thing about this, is the second time around I will be perfecting my build. When I started I was really just learning a lot of this stuff, but with how precise I have to be at work, and having built, set up, raced and now being a stand-in pit crew/set up guy for some circle track stuff, I've upped my game and learned a few things.
Next car will be getting a budget but capable home-built suspension set up. Not a perfect design, but an improvement over stock using easy to find parts.
If things go right, I might even be able to paint the car in the booth at work over the Christmas holidays which would give me 6 or 7 months to assemble the car before cruising weather comes around.

There is so much info on this site that I've gathered up over the years, building these cars now is almost as simple as being a jeep guy and ordering parts from a catalogue.

drknow90rs_ss@y

iTrader: (3)

Lol, it does get easier the second time around.
DR.K.

WTR388

Well, here is the pull when the Drive shaft let go:

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Oh, man, that's horrible to have the car ripped up like that! Glad you have the skills to deal with it though. I would be SOL if it happened to me.

WTR388

I was upset, this car has some sentimental value to me. However, the phoenix will rise. If it was just this floor damage I would fix it and run the car, but for me to be happy with it, it is a lot of work to get it where I want it. I'm looking at the new shell this weekend, so hopefully it's as simple as a roof swap (right, simple eh?) and then a fairly easy body resto and all my good parts out of one car and in to another. I forgot to mention that last spring I had the T/A in my tarp garage for 2 weeks so I could have it protected as I built my short track car in the garage, and wouldn't you know it, the garage that survived every single winter storm all winter collapsed on the car in a very late heavy, wet snow storm and it did some damage to the car as well. Somehow no glass was damaged and my fiberglass spoiler didn't even get touched.
I might consider painting my engine bay and all the jams myself and then have a legit pro paint the outer surfaces.I paint fairly often at work, but our booth is not great, and it would be almost impossible to avoid dust in there, even with wet floors and not running the fans.

Will be a fun build, hopefully I slow down and document it really well for youtube, I tend to get working and forget to set up shots.

Essentially it will be a new car with a resto similar to what whitedevilTA pulled off, except I have it easier with already having the entire drive train done and ready to go. I'm fairly confident I could do a full LS swap in to one of these cars including the wiring in like 3 or 4 days now.

RKeats

What a shame man, I can only imagine the feeling of discovering all the damage. Where abouts in Canada are you? I know of a few nice donor cars, but I'm in Ontario.

NCFarmLife

iTrader: (1)

Wow... glad nobody got hurt. I would've needed a change of shorts if I was sitting in that drivers seat for sure!

zman1969

iTrader: (9)

also be glad dint happen on street - I've heard of cars "pole vaulting" when a shaft or U-joint breaks - could of been the years of rust on shaft contributed to the failure
cars can be replaced - find one from the south and no rust repairs needed

drknow90rs_ss@y

iTrader: (3)

Wow! That driveshaft twisted apart like a cardboard tube! A driveshaft safety loop probably wouldn't have prevented the damage, this time, but your new one is so much stronger, that the u-joints are surely the weakest link in your drivetrain now. On my T-56 in my '90 RS (Built LS-7) I kept breaking yokes (Transmission). I had a lot of little dents in my trans tunnel, but it got to where I could Carry spares to the track and have it changed out in time for my next run.
DR.K.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

It's true. My cousin knew somebody that died that way in a Dodge Viper.

Annihilate

iTrader: (1)

Sooo, is this something I should be concerned about with a stock LS1? Cause yea, I never want that to happen to me ever. lmao.

dagwood

iTrader: (5)

I watched that same exact thing happen to my buddy in his stock car at the end of a straightaway. Driveshaft broke, pole vaulted, and he barrel rolled 6 times off of turn 3.

Annihilate

iTrader: (1)

Not reassuring lmao.

I am about to buy an aluminum driveshaft and swap in an LS1 and T56.

Should I save up for the more heavy duty one?

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Usually things will be fine at stock power levels, especially on street tires that don't have enormous traction. WTR388 was on a dyno with no tire slip and was probably in the neighborhood of 140-150 mph when the driveshaft failed. 3rd gens tend to have harmonics at those speeds (if I remember right), so usually not a good speed to hang out at. His driveshaft might have never failed in the real world.

If you ever do a "money shift" with your T56 then you might consider replacing the flywheel and clutch, and maybe magnaflux the driveshaft for cracks. I have a buddy that grabbed the wrong gear and did a 360° flat spin on the drag strip, never left his lane, straightened out and finished the race like nothing happened. He can drive and it was cool as ****, but his clutch exploded a few months later on a road course. It was a strap clutch (most common type of design) and we're pretty sure that the gear shift weakened it. He uses a stand type clutch now.

86White_T/A305

Honestly without seeing pics of how bad the floor damage is..I dont think giving up on the car at this point is the answer.You worked too hard on it now to not enjoy driving it after an epic driveshaft explosion.Id want to conquer the damage and say i got to fully enjoy it after that for a bit first.

Just my opinion.

WTR388

I'm in NB, but I'm from Ontario, and I go home a couple times a year. Once this covid thing allows me to actually go home to my family I can consider an Ontario car. Not many options in Atlantic Canada and everyone here has "gold". Found a car with "only" 45,000 MILES on it for 3G... Well, I think it was 145,000 considering the drivers seat was worn through, interior looked like junk, hood doesn't close right, and a million other clues that the odometer was making it second pass around.
I'm interested in finding a car where I'm not doing too much more than some rust prevention and light body work. Heck, all I need is a dang shell.

If I could, I would order a t-top shell from somewhere hot and dry. But, there is so much BS with getting a car across the border, plus relying on someone to find me the right car... But yes, a car that I know doesn't have rust hiding somewhere between some hidden pinch welds would be great and set my mind at ease. I would know it was just one last build to finish it. I was supposed to be starting building my airplane this fall until this happened.

I wouldn't worry about it as long as yours is in good shape. Replace the u-joints and run it. Everyone was somewhat shocked to see it go on this build. And unless you are being as hard on your car as what was happening on the dyno, you would have no issues. If that was the case, everyone would be telling you it is a must during an LS swap.

I just know that to fix this car it's a lot more work than what I could be doing with a cleaner shell. I won't be able to drive it this summer, so I have all winter to essentially just do body work and have an even nicer car next season.

Gotta keep the T-top vibe! Good solid sub frame connectors make a huge difference. I am considering a 4 point roll bar in the next car however just in case something ever happened where I end up on the roof.

RKeats

I have a 91' ttop Trans Am that would work pretty well for you, though you'd need to pull the drive line, and it's in Ontario haha.