Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

I know most people are going to bash me for it, but I honestly want to know how much harm it can do. My 89 GTA is nearly rust free, besides from one bubble on the passenger side fender. According to the PO it's been driven through two winters before. You can tell because the clear coat on the rims is in rough shape. Anyways, the floors are undercoated and totally rust free. The car also has a fresh coat of wax and a new set of all season rear tires on it. ANYWAYS, funds are low and I'm not going to be able to afford a winter beater, so I was wondering how much harm I'll do to my car by driving it this winter. I plan to wash it as often as possible. Any thoughts?

carlos64030

iTrader: (1)

The only harm that'll come from it is if you happen to get into an accident.

88gta3508

You will need real snow tires obviously... They handle snow decent.. you just have to watchout for the stupid suv's that can't stop... as good as they can move... Now the weight and motion are there nightmare... As long as you maintain a routine & thorough car wash
your bird will be fine...

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

I drove a Procharged 1996 Thunderbird through the winter last year, so needless to say I'm pretty careful. lol. And I totally agree with you with the thing about SUVs. They speed around as if they're unstoppable, yet it takes them even longer to slow down. People can be so dumb. My number one concern with the GTA is rust. As long as I keep it clean I hope to be allright. I don't want to drive the car, but I have to. I'll try to drive it as little as possible by carpooling with friends and such.

Impaqt

iTrader: (1)

keeping it clean is critical. Especially if you are anywhere near chicago. Pretty sure Illinois has a huge investment in salt. THey dump it all over the place.

keep it clean and you'll be fine.

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

In Roselle, about 40 minutes outside of the city. They CLUMP the salt on the roads over here

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

I drove my 89 formula 350 thru 2-3 winters. The bottom was factory undercoated and I just kept it as clean as I cud on the bottom. That was in the early 90s and to this day noo rust. Granted its been in the garage ever since.. Tires make a huge difference. If you can ditch the posi that helps.

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

Yea my front tires are summer sport tires, ZR1 rated. I should probably take those off before it snows. I'm hoping the undercoating protects my car. Washing it and garaging it looks like it's going to make all the difference. The POSI must stay. lol

hotrodln

aside of the regular rust proofing, i use allot of oil under my cars in the winter ( the ones i drive anyways) nice clean ( as in NOT USED OIL)10w30 in an oil can works pretty well.....or you can use a paint brush....i like to get it all over the rear axle till it's uniformly soaked.....yes it will drip on your floor while your doing it.........so either do it oustside or put a drop cloth down first.....a really big squiirt or two inside of the doors will really help them.......when it's running out the drain holes on the bottom you know you have enough......it would also be good to get it in the rockers if you can .......it's pretty cheap and works well.........

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Get some sand bags on the hump over the gas tank and rear axle. Yes, they are ugly, but they are pretty necessary (I use 2 for a total of 120 pounds). It doesn't matter what tires you have on the front (I had Falken Ziex ZE-512s on the front the last winter and they HATE winter), but snow tires on the rear will help a lot. I had a pair of Yokohama IG-10s (don't know if they still make these, but I know they have IG-20s now) on the back and I was cruising around the mostly unplowed parking lot at school while 4 guys had to push a 5.0 Rustang around just to get it going anywhere . And be careful on the gas pedal. Don't forget to grow a few more pairs of eyes to keep an eye out for the idiots that think they can drive 70 MPH in conditions warranting 15 .

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

Thanks for all the input everyone!

And hotrodln, I've never heard of that oil technique! Maybe it's something I'd give a shot.

@ Maverick I cannot stand how overconfident certain people drive in the snow. You're completley right, watching out for others is half the battle. lol

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Got stuck driving home in my car in what basically amounted to an ice storm, the second one I'd been driving through . Woman came out from a side street and the only thing that saved me from getting T-boned was mashing the gas and swinging out the tail of my car (no snows and mismatched tires on the rear). Funny part was that not even 10 minutes after I got home, there was a t-bone accident at the end of my street involving a Jeep Cherokee . Don't remember what the other car was, but that Cherokee was nailed in the front, seemed like he may have gotten sideswiped, IIRC, but I'm pretty sure it was a t-bone.

Good luck driving in the winter... Keep your baby clean as possible and check EVERYTHING in the spring for stone and salt damage, and repair it ASAP when found.

NCGuy68

Good advice about the snow tires and sand bags in the trunk over the axle. BUT....We all know that road salt is the kiss of death. Spray, clean, wipe, etc. the undercarrage TWICE as often as the exterior.

formula forever

one thing to add is take those turns slow. I remember long time ago I sled right of the road driving my gta. Be safe and try not parking on main roads.

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

Parking on the streets in general when there is snow on the ground is a big no-no! Too much chance for disaster.

All these accident stories scary me, I can't even imagine what I'd do if something happened to my car.

My shift kit is just going to make things even worse too. I chirp gears so easily when it's wet outsite, I can't even imagine what it'll be like in ice or snow.

Yea I'm trying to make sure all rock chips and blemishes are touched up now before any salt can get to them. I literally plan on washing my car every two to three days. This car will hopefully never see another winter after this one.

The main reason I'm stuck driving it this winter is cuz of myself. Two speeding tickets really puts a setback on winter car funds. That AND needing a new starter last week really got me bad.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Go through a spray wash that sprays the undercarriage too once a week when the roads are salted. Doesnt hurt to drive it less

I made it through a nasty Ohio winter with summer tires in my bird and no undercoating. Still have no rust anywhere. I dont recommend summer tires in the snow though. Very scary at points

AutoRoc

iTrader: (1)

Find some 16's and get some 225/55/16 snow tires. I had a ball driving my IROC in the winter with them... A couple hundred pounds in the hatch well helped too. And keeping the tank full. dont forget the HEET.

T/Atime

make sure to bring lock de-icer and a cloth to wipe down the door jams and weather stripping. this will ice up fast and lock you out.

dont worrie too much about the shift kit your gas pedal will only be down a little so should still be shifting soft. pack a shovel too.

i would not worrie about the dead of winter, its those mild days when the snow is melting that will make you cry cuz its so sloppy. then wash everyday, lol. good luck.

ive all ways own two cars for the past 12 years to avoid driving in the winter. now i have a dd instead of a winter car. if its just for this winter dont beat your self up 2bad.

Thirdgen89GTA

iTrader: (5)

They ARE "un-stoppable"

But as far as winter going goes, they aren't that hard to wheel around. it can be rough on some days.

DD9TransAmGTA

iTrader: (1)

I live in springfield,il they get a little crazy with the salt, you should be fine though. If my mom drove a Porsche Boxster in one of the worst winters you should be fine

IROZINCO

iTrader: (1)

i had some variety of 2nd/3rd gen f-body as DD for years. And i totally agree with the SUV issue, they can't get it thru their heads that 4wd does NOT equal 4 wheel STOP! I went more places in my 1st 87 IROC, in WY and WA, and CO. BLizzards across Kansas, snowstorms in CO, you name it. You HAVE to know how to drive in the stuff, and you must MUST get good snow tires. NOT all season. The biggest issue with these cars is ground clearance, and that will stop you more than anything. Anything more than 6 inches, and forget about it. Weight in the back is good, but don't put in too much. It'll make it harder to stop. As stated above, its the OTHER idiots you have to watch out for. After any snow here, the ditches are FULL of upside down 4x4's from people driving way to fast for conditions. I used to drive by those folks in my sports car and laugh, and laugh, and laugh....... Boy, do i have the stories.....

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

Do the doors and locks really ice up that easily? Gotta love not having keyless entry! As everyone keeps saying, it's just a matter of taking your time and driving slow. Should be interesting. At least my heat works! For now.... lol

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

and totally unrelated, but this is last year's DD.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

As far as the doors and such icing shut, spray the weatherstripping with silicone spray lube first. It will soak in, and it's clear, so it won't be quite so messy. Also, be sure to make sure the door latches are properly lubed so that the doors will release from the latch pins.

Be glad you don't have an early FWD 2-door W-body... Broke 2 pairs of door handles on mine over the 2 winters I had it (well, one pair, but had to replace the driver's handle twice due to not lubing parts before snow fell ). And also bent the door slightly prying it open when it froze shut (wasn't about to lose yet ANOTHER exterior door handle at $40 a pop for the cheap ones )... Good thing the idiot I sold it to didn't notice .

eseibel67

Hold it! Don't drive it in the winter. I'm not saying this because of the safety aspect. Good tires will get you around without any problems if you know how to drive.

The problem is rust. The chemicals that are used today for de-icing are ultra-corrosive. All that talk about oiling, rinsing, waxing is all bullsh!t. Especially on third gens in general, that are prone to rust in the first place, and yours in particular because you have a spot that's already started.

Other problems with winter driving include slushy, salty boot runoff draining through the carpet and onto the floorpan (where it never dries), heavy snow damaging the wiper system, and sandy, silty roads are continuously blasting your car from every angle. These are just off the top of my head, there are 10 more reasons that winter driving will kill your GTA.

If you drive it, kiss it goodbye. You will regret it.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

I have to call on that one... I live in WNY, between both lake snow bands, and I know plenty of people that have nice cars that are driven in the winter (well, not Vette nice, but nice looking). Personal experience... My father's 00 Grand Prix never went without seeing a winter, and the ONLY reason that is dead is because some ignorant woman on a cell phone rearended him at over 40 MPH (well over, but nobody would say the exact number), totalling it in 2007. Only reason my neighbors just had the fenders, quarters, and rockers replaced on their Alero was because the body never got cleaned underneath the rocker trim plate (similar to GFX but not GFX), and the stuff ate through the paint (tip: DO NOT TRUST ZIEBART... They screwed my neighbors B A D). That car is PERFECT otherwise.

Being EXTREMELY **** about cleanliness during the winter months is CRUCIAL to the life of your car, in and out. And yes, in the spring, I would definitely remove the GFX and clean underneath just to make sure nothing sits there that can eat the paint off.

lolvtec

i drove my 91 vert last winter and it will be some of this winter and its a az car and there is still no rust on it just wash it and wax it when ever chance you can

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

chevman24

iTrader: (1)

I drove my 88 Camaro in the winter here in WI for 4 or so winters. Now im replacing both quarters and some rusty metal on the floor. If it were my car Id park it, but if you really need too drive it, wash it ALOT!!!! Yould be surprised at how rusty things will get driving it for just one winter season.

travis401

iTrader: (1)

i drove my camaro the first winter i had it in WA(back in 07), i dont have a spec of rust on it. the car is hard to control on slush and ice without great tires and possibly chains, thats why i bought a 4x4 truck. as long as you wash all the road salt and crap off regularly you wont have an issue

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

And don't forget to make sure your weatherstripping is good along the roof line if you run the car through one of those spray washes during the winter... Last thing you need is for the car to start rotting from the inside out (ask how I know ). Also, behind the front fenders, where they meet the rocker panels, there may be a chunk of body sealer that came loose. I've seen pics on here and also in person MANY F-bodies that get rust behind the kick panels because this spot of sealer has broken loose and lets water into the rockers (complex bend that requires a BIG glob of sealer to close). And there is a similar joint at the bottom of the rear wheel well lip where the quarters meet the rocker. Lastly, check where the pieces of the rear wheel wells come together in the spare tire compartment and rear storage compartment. This spot will be rather high, but it's where about 4 pieces of sheet metal come together and also requires a BIG glob of sealer that may have broken loose by now. Plug them all.

mustangdmurder

iTrader: (3)

Do not do it the road salt kills all metal. If you can get a cheap vehicle for the winter so you don't have to kill your GTA. If you absolutely have to drive it during the winter undercoat it really thick, keep it really clean on the underside and avoid driving it as much as possible.

UnstableAviator

I wouldn't do it. Unless you've got some sort of inside garage you can wash it in, it may be days or even a week+ before you can wash it since temps stay well below freezing after the initial snowstorm.

Modern cars certainly don't seem as rust prone as a 3rd Gen, a local trip to a junkyard will confirm that. Newer cars - no rust. 3rd Gens - rust buckets.

hotrodln

Modern cars certainly don't seem as rust prone as a 3rd Gen, a local trip to a junkyard will confirm that. Newer cars - no rust. 3rd Gens - rust buckets. [/QUOTE]

I agree- with the exception of brake lines and gas lines....i think they make them out of plain steel with a smidgeon of paint on them just to drive us nuts when they start rusting out....the car makers also STILL can't get rockers to survive the life of the car.....gotta find a way to squirt some 10w-30 in there!

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

I have to disagree... At the yards I've been to, most of the 3rd gens have been there for a LONG time. If you were to put ANY car in a muddy dirty hole for a LONG time, it would rust as well. And I've seen brake, fuel, and power steering lines rust LONG before the rest of the car (Dodge/Chrysler and F0rd, and of course, my own, where the engine oil from the leaking pan gasket didn't coat the lines).

Again, make sure that there is body sealer where there is supposed to be sealer, and keep it clean. If it's only for one season, there won't be any problems.

rob2000gt

iTrader: (1)

Dont ruin a rust free car. My GTA only seen a couple winters and the floor pan on the driver side was gone. Rear caliper slides rusted solid and ebrake parts eather broke or rusted solid. Oh yea not to mention when I replaced my pan hard and lower control arms all bolts had to be cut at both ends and had to spread the mounts to get everything out. My car is under coated floor pan rusted from the inside out. When I lived in Wisconsin I had new tires with less than 5k miles on them I pulled my car out of the garage to clean the floor and once the rear tires hit the snow they started to spin just idling. I never left the driveway because I didnt want to wreck my car.

Blown 346

iTrader: (12)

I had to drive my 2000 SS thur a few winters when it was the only car I had. I ran it thru a touchless wash and made sure to get the under carraige. Put some snow tires on it all the way around and never had any rust issues. As long as you dont let the salt residue sit on the car you wont have a problem.

It does suck, even with snow tires, you will slid around and have issue going up hills without a head start.

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

I'm hearing two total extremes here, some saying my car will wither away and some saying I'll be okay.

@Maverick - thanks for the tips on where to check for the spots of seam sealer, definatley want to make sure that's all there before it gets salty out.

My grandma drives a 92 Firebird and she's the original owner, it's seen about 6 winters and the wheel wells got it bad but the floord are still okay, she's also getting some rust under the GFX. I really plan to wash my car every other day when there's salt out, and carpool as much as possible. I love this car and will take all precautions. I'm so pissed I don't have the funds for a winter car. Driving this car in the winter wasn't in my plans...

rob2000gt

iTrader: (1)

Good luck with driving it. Make sure you melt all the snow from the bottom of your car before you run it through the car wash. Once the water from the undercarrage wash hits the snow it turns to ice. It really hard for a automatic car wash to blast the snow and salt off from under the car.

chevman24

iTrader: (1)

When you wash it go to a self serve wash. Those touchles places don't get your car clean.

lolvtec

mikes carwash does for 20 a pop

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

Touchless? No way! I do it all by hand at the DIY bays. 2 bucks gets me five minutes, I usually do about 6-7 minutes. The water is heated and everything. That way I can make sure I spray the bottom real nice.

T/Atime

dont stress too much, is only one winter. do what you have to do if money is tight. make a game plan to buy a good reliable winter or dd. if you own another dd (winter and summer) insured all year long then you can avoid driving in the rain, snow and bad parking lots...

my car was broken into with an attempted theft after that day i changed the way i protected it.

good luck!

lolvtec

get a s10 600 bucks might be a pos but who cares

eseibel67

^This is the answer. If you can't swing a beater, you have to bum a ride, take the bus, or walk.

And there is no controversey here. If you drive you car in the salt, you mess it up with 100% certainty.

Undercoating and oil spraying will NOT help. They only coat the surfaces you can see. Salt spray gets into EVERY little crevice that you cannot see, and that's where the rust starts.

Guys on here that are telling you they drove thier car through a salty winter with no ill effects are doing you a disservice. Just because the rust isn't bubbling through the paint yet doesn't mean the corrosion hasn't started.

But it's your car, do what you want. If your plans are to keep it for a few years and then ditch it, you might get away with it. If you plan on keeping it long term --------> keep it dry.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Uh, no. Like I said, I know quite a few people whose DDs see winter, every snowy, salty, crappy day of it, every year, and they're not new cars, but they look like it. But, if you insist that keeping the car clean doesn't work and the car is going to look like Swiss cheese after five months...

91 Droptop

Do not silicone your weatherstripping, it will deteriorate it, it is what is in Armoral and that is the worst crap ever invented

Mike92Firebird

iTrader: (3)

Well it isn't like i'll be forced to continually drive it throughout the winter, it will be my only car, yet I'll carpool with friends when possible and try to carpool with people I work with to get to work.When I do drive it, I'll have to try my best to clean every knook and cranny to get rid of all the salt. Wish me luck I guess :/
All of this actually makes me really sad. I gave my car an incredible full detail today, and in an ideal world, I would be putting it away for winter after that. Sadly it's staying out, and the worse is yet to come. It's funny how when I had the Tbird I looked forward to driving in the snow. Haha

deadbird

Took mine (ex-'91) 8 years,115k miles, to start a quarter size spot on the drivers rear wheel arch. I may have washed it 6x while owning it.

hotrodln

you WON'T see rust on the sides of your car from one winter. It is a slow process. the first areas to be affected will be any poorly painted suspension parts....i drive an escalade in the winter and i painted the crap out of the underside before the first winter.....no affects the first winter....minor rusting on the rear diff and springs the second winter....and so on....por 15 paint works great, i also go under there with a squirt can of CLEAN 10-30 motor oil and get everything nice and wet.....yup it makes a mess!....but oiled metal can't rust.....it's also good inside your door skins....i'm currently trying to think of a way to get it inside my rockers on my other cars....i'd rather not drill holes....but might end up doing it anyways! you WILL make it through one winter!!